Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 94

@radioguy Most likely. The diagrams of the BWR-4 reactor that has been on here quite a bit show that to be about the case.
by Dennis Tucker Jr 3/27/2011 3:56:18 PM

There is a file photo from Sept. of #4 with what looks like the yellow containment cap removed. Not sure of the exact relation of the SFP and cap storage. One would guess they have somewhere the cap resides when they are doing maint. work. totallycoolpix.com
by Nancy edited by elainekirk 3/27/2011 3:56:39 PM

@vasra They probably say that because it is complicated and could take days....do you know how to detect Plutonium? I don't....
by borrrden 3/27/2011 3:56:43 PM

@ Hermine We know 4 was because the newly removed spent fuel is in the SFP. 5 and 6 were shut down at the time. Not empty, but cold shutdown.
by radioguy 3/27/2011 3:57:09 PM

@Vasra - bet they have the results of the plutonium tests - and not letting on
by fiona 3/27/2011 3:57:10 PM

@borrrden with modern japanese on site analytical methods, it takes about 60 minutes to detect Pu-239 and Pu-240 from soil samples : www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
by vasra 3/27/2011 3:58:53 PM

@Vasra I'd have been testing for uranium and plutonium since day one, myself.
by radioguy 3/27/2011 3:59:03 PM

I do not know if this has been posted yet. Where Did the Water in the Spent Fuel Pools Go? allthingsnuclear.org
by Ralph Unger 3/27/2011 4:00:47 PM

Does anybody have any solid evidence as to whether or not their are still workers at the plant currently?
by Dennis Tucker Jr 3/27/2011 4:01:10 PM

@Ralph Yeah, but it's most definetly worth reposting!!
by marie rich 3/27/2011 4:01:28 PM

Complicated or not, i would imagine they have equipment that could detect plutonium, and i cant belive they have been waiting this long to test for it.
by Treiagonaut 3/27/2011 4:01:30 PM

thank you
by Hermine 3/27/2011 4:01:34 PM

The U.S. have rad teams there- you can bet your last yen they have readings
by marie rich 3/27/2011 4:02:06 PM

@Dennis Tucker Jr According to the latest reports I've read (sorry, no links). Since the evacuation of the plant 2 workers, I read that there are still 600+ wokers on the plant premises altogether working in shifts.
by vasra 3/27/2011 4:02:38 PM

Consistent with U.S. policy, they won't let you know capabilities. (trust me on that particular, I know first hand)
by marie rich 3/27/2011 4:03:55 PM

I would have been testing for fissile material the moment core breach was a possibility. It would have been the only definative way of testing if the reactors were leaking.
by Treiagonaut 3/27/2011 4:06:20 PM

@vasra @Treiagonaut It is very easy for us to sit here and criticize from afar. Remember that for a long time they were severely undermanned for this job.
by borrrden 3/27/2011 4:06:36 PM

Delayed neutron activation analysis detects plutonium in three minutes www.eurekalert.org
by Bobby1 3/27/2011 4:06:40 PM

*stray thought* There's already a big imbalance of male to female in Asia, particularly China. If Japanese men become sterile from rad, where will they get their women? Historical analysis shows a correlation between male/female ratios and aggression.
by marie rich 3/27/2011 4:07:55 PM

also if they had been testing for pluutonium/uranium and had detected nothing, they would have made damn sure the public knew.
by Treiagonaut 3/27/2011 4:08:18 PM

@Treiagonaut And if they did make sure the public knew, people on here would be calling it lies...
by borrrden 3/27/2011 4:08:58 PM

@borrrden I completely agree on that (easy to criticize, diffiThcult conditions, over-worked, over manned). But the fact that they keep refusing help and trying to do heroic efforts by themselves is not very professional. To me it still looks too much like typical saving face, damage control and information containment. And yes, working on the spot is 10000x times more difficult, but still.
by vasra edited by George Gibb 3/27/2011 4:09:00 PM

@borrrden That might be true, but you miss the point. It's their job to report. It's not their issue to think about whether they are called liars. But witholding information is bad disaster management communications. I know from experience :)
by vasra 3/27/2011 4:10:22 PM

I wish NHK World would translate articles like this. Concerns about the work behind the leak of radioactive material. www3.nhk.or.jp
by Ralph Unger 3/27/2011 4:11:24 PM

Here's the full text article for analysis of Pu in soil samples in 60 min. Paper recieved June 2005 Accepted Dec. 2005 www.jstage.jst.go.jp
by Jim Carver 3/27/2011 4:11:48 PM

@borrrden It is an awfull position to be in, i dont dissagree. But to solve the problem you first have to understand it.
by Treiagonaut 3/27/2011 4:12:13 PM

@borrrden Undermanned or not, what should TEPCO have done as soon as they realized they had damage to the Fukushima facility? I'm not a nuclear engineer but I've managed safety organizations in the past and I would have been testing for radiation the instant the shaking stopped. In fact, an article appeared just recently describing an attempt to test everyone for radiation before they let them leave the facility. The workers and engineers got so angry that they were released after about 20 minutes.
by James Ward 3/27/2011 4:14:18 PM

I googled plutonium testing. I found two articles. One mentions a commercially available unit that can detect plutonium at a distance in seconds. A NYT article that mentions the use of equipment to do it at ports. Also a US govt. report of newer ways to quickly detect small amounts of plutonium. Plutonium detection seems to be the core of anti-proliferation activities to detect terrorist nukes etc. www.eurekalert.org docs.google.com www.nytimes.com
by Nancy 3/27/2011 4:14:40 PM

@vasra I think it would be fair to say no disaster plan in place for this kind of disaster but behind the scene there is a lot of things going on that we will never be made of aware of.
by George Gibb 3/27/2011 4:16:02 PM

@James Ward - I read that article as well, it mentioned that there were a number of workers (200, I think) who were trapped in the inside after the power went out (ie. no lights) and were afraid that a tsunami was going to come. If I were in there, I would be fighting to get out. They can test me on the roof, but the way management handled it was poorly thought out.
by kayko 3/27/2011 4:16:30 PM

There is available tech to test for plutonium on the fly or quickly. So either they are lying to avoid releasing data or they don't have any of that equipment and are trying to get it. The Japanese defence forces or the US navy should have it.
by Nancy 3/27/2011 4:16:37 PM

Might I mention that the plutonium in the MOX fuel is actually plutonium oxide? I'm not a chemist but that could be what makes it harder to detect?
by borrrden 3/27/2011 4:16:45 PM

@all: Pardon me if this information is redundant, I read the last few pages and didn't notice it mentioned. Hope it's helpful. The operator of a crippled nuclear plant in Japan has retracted an announcement that radiation in water near one of the reactors was 10 million times higher than normal, Jiji Press reports.

Tokyo Electric Power (TEPCO) said the mistake was due to confusion between readings of iodine and cobalt in the water.

Earlier TEPCO said radiation of more than 1000 millisieverts per hour had been detected in puddles of water thought to have leaked from the the number two reactor at its Fukushima Daiichi plant.
by Tenzing 3/27/2011 4:16:46 PM

Has anyone an idea what the thing in the red circle could be? It can be seen in the first few seconds of the new video, especially good at 3-4 seconds. <img src="pics\MjLkO.jpg" alt="" title="Hosted by imgur.com" />
by Salvador via I.imgur 3/27/2011 4:17:15 PM

@all link for previous post news.smh.com.au
by Tenzing 3/27/2011 4:17:38 PM

@ALL FYI, I reviewed the Reuters blog and this one. The analysis has been prescient. We beat the news agencies (and I suspect the TEPCO engineers) by a mile! *pat on back* :)
by marie rich 3/27/2011 4:17:52 PM

@marie rich : i am very sure they are fully aware of the situation. but they will not publish anything. i remember EU commissioner Oettinger, 10 days ago he stated that there was a worst case scenario, but he was disregarded for this.
by Matsuoko 3/27/2011 4:18:10 PM

Maybe someone could try to document all the lies, mis-statements, half-truths, etc. TEPCO puts out. The PU testing is just the latest.
by Jim Carver 3/27/2011 4:18:22 PM

@Salvador Think it's the spent fuel pool, but not positive
by marie rich 3/27/2011 4:19:34 PM

@Tenzing I'm just having a very difficult time believing anything TEPCO reports at this point in time, good or bad. Their credibility has bottomed out in my opinion. Even the Japanese PM had to ask "what the hell is going on" several days ago when TEPCO failed to keep him informed.
by James Ward 3/27/2011 4:19:59 PM

@James Ward Well unfortunately, aren't they the only firsthand source of information?
by borrrden 3/27/2011 4:20:48 PM

@marie I would think the spend fuel pool should be on the south- east side of the building, that would be right of the structure I was asking about. There is a lot of steam around this thing, as can be seen in the still, but even better in the video.
by Salvador 3/27/2011 4:21:11 PM