Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 2436

images.scribblelive.com @Edano, notice the bent red pipe, its color and diamater remind me of the 'toothpick' you spotted.
by Ian 10/1/2011 12:58:42 PM

by Ian 10/1/2011 12:59:57 PM

@Ian I think the air contamination is only being compared to chernobyl frequently forgetting the sea contamination. The sea contamination is harder to quantify. If someone takes TEPCOs sea readings they would say there isn't any. I can see 10 years down the road someone taking TEPCO's sea readings like we now see people picking that "9 people died at chernobyl" line wherever they got that from. TEPCO and the GOVT have lots of inaccurate overly positive readings that later get refuted. Will the inacurate ones end up being used to downplay the accident in 10 years?
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:02:01 PM

@Ian : fuku 370,000 terabecquerels* (as of 12 April) cherrnobyl 5.2 million terabecquerels* (i can't find the footnote- ah i found it) according to bbc.

firstly: as of april 12, there is missing all the emissions (esp. cooling water into the ocean) until today.

secondly: 370,000 terabecquerels (370,000,000,000,000,000 or 37E16) and 5.2 million terabecquerels (5,200,000,000,000,000,000 or 52E17) is about the same dimension. factors like "10 times" do not mean as much as they sound in these dimensions.
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:04:36 PM

I forgot my password on the forum.. so they hopefully are sending me one
by dean 10/1/2011 1:05:34 PM

@Edano If that is of april and only by air Fuku could still reach that level. What time frame is the Chernobyl release documented as?
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:08:29 PM

comparing to tmi: 570 terabecquerels (570,000,000,000 = 57E10) de.wikipedia.org
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:12:13 PM

@lillymunster no timeframe.
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:14:00 PM

@Edano Fuku isn't done spewing. It would be an interesting numbers exercise to make sure all releases are tracked until there is true containment. What confuses the public about these fuku - chernobyl comparisons is that Chernobyl spewed most of its core high into the air. I see Chernobyl used to downplay Fuku. I think visuals play a part also.
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:20:58 PM

@Dean, are you up for some NRC
document reading next week?
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:21:49 PM

YOU BET.. @ lilly
by dean 10/1/2011 1:22:00 PM

this is gobsmacking they remove a small patch of grass growing in a crack in the tarmac and radiation levels drop so why are they leaving all the overgrown areas to blow around in the autumn winds? www.tepco.co.jp
by elainekirk 10/1/2011 1:22:43 PM

@ lilly.. so far has there been any video at all of #4 explosion?
by dean 10/1/2011 1:22:58 PM

@Edano, Joieau has a post about the high seivert ratings in unit 1 over on Daily Kos and is getting regularly beat up by a few nuclear apologists. Want to go over and give her some love? :-)
www.dailykos.com
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:24:35 PM

@dean so far no.
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:24:52 PM

@lillymunster will go look :)
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:25:03 PM

@elaine.. the photo of interest in there is,,,, the puddle one.. two separate photos... that's what it looks like to me... smoke n mirrors
by dean 10/1/2011 1:25:30 PM

@lillymunster ho is Joieau ? (s)he adopted our corium crust cracking theory !
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:29:11 PM

@dean it is all PR they are showing the public how safe it is even in the plant and how when people in the zone wash their houses down the radiation will be all gone or at least negligable sorry I should have said I was being sarcastic when I posted
by elainekirk 10/1/2011 1:30:51 PM

@elaine.. your comment was spot on... .I wouldn't be surprised if they paint new plants on the walls they build and say.. reactors all running and ok
by dean 10/1/2011 1:33:39 PM

@Edano I ran across Joieau last week when her diary ended up in Google news feed. She worked on the TMI investigation in some manner and seems to have a solid background on the subjects. I have been talking with her privately, she might pop over here at some point to talk. She is tired of the political bashing at Kos. She has been posting some good info.
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:34:09 PM

@dean I think I have a plan for centrally documenting the info we find in the data dump. Might have a couple of non-scribblers interested in the issue willing to help read through emails.
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:35:24 PM

@Dean, There is a big public meeting with the NRC about the GE Mark 1 units. Beyond Nuclear is asking people to get on the phone portion of the meeting. Do you know if that (phone in) allows people to speak at the meeting in some fashion? This meeting seems to be huge, look at the list of who is going to be there. www.beyondnuclear.org
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:38:40 PM

i have the vision of connecting all the nuclear critic blogs to a global network against the nuke industry, so we can create a powerful counter-publicity. physicsforum, fukushima diary, skf (?), goddards, all the blogs. we should cross-link each other. we have to concentrate our power.
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:40:52 PM

@Edano very good idea. I'm not sure what would be the best method, some sort of "network" link to have on each site along with links to the others?
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:42:41 PM

Does anyone have a link to the MEXT map for the new radiation find in Chiba?
www.asahi.com
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:43:36 PM

@ lilly sounds good,,, also, I went over and read that piece that Joieau wrote on her theory----- "in part have to surmise that regular continuing earthquakes in the Fukushima area are causing corium that remains in or below the containment to crack, causing renewed fission upon contact of interior molten fuel with water. Renewed fission reheats the corium in the usual exponential fashion which keeps it molten, though due to it being a semi-coherent mass rather than an intact core designed for maximum fuel-water contact, the criticality doesn't last very long." ....... she is "SUMISING" and explaining a very complex nuclear physics theory on fissioning etc. I wish she had some technical support for her claim.. Nuclear Engineers would respond better... the cracking theory is indeed something that originated here and i have told those I know that this is another area of severe accident analyses that nceeds to be done
by dean 10/1/2011 1:44:06 PM

fissions woudn't have to occur to elevate the radiation levels from cracking and shifting corium...
by dean 10/1/2011 1:44:59 PM

the "shine' given off from that process would conceivably be enough to do it
by dean 10/1/2011 1:45:30 PM

measurement of fission fragment isotopes as has been done correlates to a fission process taking place
by dean 10/1/2011 1:46:27 PM

@lillymunster I will look for map
by elainekirk 10/1/2011 1:46:32 PM

@lillymunster usually this is done by exchanging banners. every group posts the banners of the others.
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:47:06 PM

I would want her to explain and discuss more of the physics involved
by dean 10/1/2011 1:47:48 PM

we could begin with an "our friends" menu...and ask the others to follow.
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:48:20 PM

@lillymunster this is the 29th that the article quotes
radioactivity.mext.go.jp
I found this for 1st Oct
radioactivity.mext.go.jp
looking for english now
by elainekirk 10/1/2011 1:51:36 PM

@Edano could you make up a list of who you think should be on it? I could then find contact info for all and we could propose it.
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 1:53:41 PM

we all are doing the same under different angles. some time ago and repeatedly i mentioned that the real problem is the mighty industry cartel with their PR. we should try to fight it. i don't think there already is a global initiative, and now the time is up.
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:56:13 PM

@lillymunster yes, i will make a pinned list, and we can add.
by Edano 10/1/2011 1:56:37 PM

@elainekirk there should be a visual map somewhere. They released one last time
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 2:02:36 PM

@dean yes dean, i agree totally, this should be discussed cross-boardly.
by Edano 10/1/2011 2:02:44 PM

@dean I think the challenge is she is trying to write for average readers so they can understand and then gets lambasted by a couple of people who just want to discredit anything that is unflattering to commercial nuclear power.
by lillymunster 10/1/2011 2:03:51 PM

will walk the children for a while. c u.
by Edano 10/1/2011 2:05:25 PM

ok I will behave after this one www.tepco.co.jp look at that area of 'steam' what is making that?
by elainekirk edited by dean 10/1/2011 2:06:47 PM

@ lilly maybe a conversation with her would aid her approach.. but it does sound like she's had experience... nuc engineering deals in probabilities, consequences, words like,,,it's possible,, or credible to save themselves.. she used the work sumise which I know would raise eyebrows and invite the PROVE it... would be glad to exchange with her some.. if it would help
by dean 10/1/2011 2:08:06 PM

@ elaine,.. you find the details so magnificently .. QUEEN FOR THE DAY... they will probably say they were steam cleaning the radiation
by dean 10/1/2011 2:10:08 PM