Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 2430

Night Lilly!
by LM 9/30/2011 2:38:38 AM

Notice the sequential pattern of reactor cooling mirrors the sequence of the explosions - fist blast #1, second #3, third #2. It's as if the same meltdown process is still unfolding.

So given that we know corium is still boiling water with reactors below boiling, it seems that Unit 1 corium is boring down into the ground deepest as it's had the most time to do so after its earliest explosion. And Unit 3's having exploded next and it is cooling the next fastest as it's corium bores down deeper and thus further away from its consequently cooling reactor. Of course maybe that isn't what's happening, but it seems to fit the data at this moment.
by Ian 9/30/2011 2:41:46 AM

images.scribblelive.com Meant to include this, see my comment immediately below...
by Ian 9/30/2011 2:42:42 AM

Another fact might imply a China syndrome is drywell radiation levels have also fallen, the same slow decline as heat, and now about equal to the ambient radiation in the buildings, as if it doesn't exist anymore. However, anywhere in the same room as the Elephant's Foot at Chernobyl was astronomically radioactive!

So how could the radiation of water-boiling corium at Fukushima be slowly falling to almost local background if it was still in the same room as the senors? Well, radiation falls off rapidly over distance. So if the corium is boring down a China-syndrome hole, it's (1) increasing its distance from the drywell sensors and thus decreasing drywell radiation; and (2) its radio-emissions over 360 degrees are increasingly aimed at and absorbed into the underground soil surrounding it as it bores a hole. Both facts suggest a signature of a China syndrome could be falling drywell heat and radiation, as we're seeing @Fuku. But that might not be the only explanation of the data.
by Ian 9/30/2011 3:34:13 AM

@Ian The problem with that theory is that it doesn't fit the data we have from computer simulations on one hand, and «real» data from TEPCO on the other. If the molten cores had indeed gone through the 7 meter thick base mat, they would have done so in late March. It's now late September and the molten cores would have dug their way down underground. The data from March, April, May and June, at least, doesn't match your theory. Plus, if that would be the case, water would have been seeping underground and there would be none to be found in the units basements. I believe that scenario is highly unlikely, considering the data we have gathered so far.
by Pedro Jesus 9/30/2011 3:51:59 AM

@Pedro Jesus, yea, maybe not. But I presume you have data on bore-down rates since you say these rates of cooling and radiation fall are too slow. Also, what data from March, April, May and June, at least, doesn't match China syndrome?
by Ian 9/30/2011 4:04:10 AM

If the corium behaves like at Chernobyl, it wont bore down. But at Chernobyl it co-mingled with sand due to the reactor design there, and that was believed to help solidify it.
by Ian 9/30/2011 4:06:47 AM

@Ian I don't have that data. You must address Dean about it. It might be available at www.simplyinfo.org

You can't compare Chernobyl with Fukushima. Fukushima's cores have far more fuel than that at Chernobyl for one, and also they didn't explode and they didn't got scattered by the explosions that happened at Chernobyl. So it would corrode in a different way, obviously a lot faster. As to the composition of the Fukushima Daiichi underground, we're still oblivious about it, aren't we. I'm not dismissing that possibility, only saying that according to the data we have it is most unlikely.
by Pedro Jesus 9/30/2011 4:15:47 AM

@Ian About your other question, well, radiation emissions has been going up and down although the overall trend has pointed downwards. You wouldn't expect that if the core's would have melted through to the underground in late March as computer simulations Dean gathered indicate. I think the only reason it didn't happen is because water injections have been keeping them cool enough to not be able to corrode the concrete. If they had corroded through in the early weeks of the disaster, temperature, pressure and radiation readings would be a lot different from that what we have been presented with so far.
by Pedro Jesus 9/30/2011 4:23:05 AM

Please excuse my grammar. I should be at bed by now...
by Pedro Jesus 9/30/2011 4:23:40 AM

Government to store radioactive waste in Tokyo, seven prefectures www.asahi.com
by Mid Valley 9/30/2011 4:45:38 AM

@Pedro Jesus, not sure I don't follow. You say computer simulations Dean gathered that indicate the core melted to underground in late March are not constant with the data. But I still dont' see exactly what data it is you're referring to.
by Ian 9/30/2011 5:14:59 AM

@Pedro Jesus, the only data you seem to cite is the known data and its conflict with what you're saying we should expect to see if there was a China syndrome. But what is it you have in mind that we should expect to see that we've not?
Also, I didn't compare Fukushima to Chernobyl as any basis of what I argued, just a periphery comment. So citing that they obviously differ (which was even my point) has no bearing on the Fuku scenario I proposed.
by Ian 9/30/2011 5:19:39 AM

www.houseoffoust.com

now hit me with a steel rebar ! once more, we had that big quake, and a #1 rad reading above 400 Sv/hr afterwards ! this is not just coincidence !
by Edano via Houseoffoust 9/30/2011 7:07:27 AM

@Edano morning
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 7:58:10 AM

Morning @all
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 7:58:32 AM

@hudebnik hi great to see you
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 7:58:54 AM

@Edano - you have to be right on that.
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 7:58:56 AM

Hi @Elaine
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 7:59:06 AM

@hudebnik I am really glad Edano has pinned it down
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 7:59:40 AM

@Elaine - yes I think it is pretty conclusive. So much for 'cold shutdown'. Edano's graphs are BRILLIANT.
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 8:01:35 AM

@hudebnik awesome and on organise there was a post an hr ago saying fuku shaking so if there was another quake today
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 8:03:04 AM

There were 2 mag 5 quakes in Japan today, one quite near Fuku earthquake.usgs.gov
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 8:04:47 AM

Fujimura confirms lifting of evacuation advisory

Chief Cabinet Secretary Osamu Fujimura has made it clear that an evacuation advisory for 5 municipalities outside the 20-kilometer no-go zone around the troubled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant will be lifted within the day.

Fujimura told reporters on Friday that a formal decision will be made at a meeting of the government's nuclear accident task force in the evening.

He said restoration plans submitted by the municipalities differ slightly in content, but he vowed that the government will strongly support them in all areas, including the removal of radioactive materials.

Nuclear crisis minister Goshi Hosono told reporters that he wanted to lift the advisory as soon as possible, as it has created hardships for the local residents.

Calling the latest step a major turning point, Hosono stressed that efforts to contain the nuclear accident have entered a new phase, in which residents are encouraged to return to their normal lives.

Friday, September 30, 2011 12:18 +0900 (JST)

www3.nhk.or.jp
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 8:07:11 AM

@hudebnik unit 1 is I cant believe they are forcing people back once it is lifted they will not get evac compo
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 8:11:19 AM

@Elaine - Well who'd have thunk it, eh?
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 8:12:37 AM

@hudebnik just madness why the hell did that prat invent the bloody wheel look what he/she started
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 8:15:36 AM

Right, time to get weaving. I'll see you all around. I've been lurking from time to time but haven't found much fresh to contribute lately. Maybe that will be the pattern from now on, not much fresh news and so less press interest. A sort of cold shutdown of press coverage as well
1
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 8:16:09 AM

@hudebnik great to see you and hope you are back to join in again soon
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 8:16:51 AM

@Elaine - I'll do my best! Ciaou!
by hudebnik 9/30/2011 8:19:38 AM

Latest (small) earthquake 1.5 hrs ago
16:55 JST 30 Sep 2011 36.7N 140.7E 10 km 3.2 Ibaraki-ken Hokubu
by Luisa 9/30/2011 8:25:58 AM

link www.jma.go.jp
by Luisa 9/30/2011 8:26:29 AM

damn, i would like to slap tepco with my graphs. what's happening in #1 ? the drywell cam B must be right next to the corium. 405 Sv/hr. instrument failure ? ha-ha !
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:27:20 AM

Tokyo plans to store, burn debris from disaster zone search.japantimes.co.jp
by Luisa 9/30/2011 8:28:27 AM

@Luisa obviously aftershocks of the 5.6 yesterday.
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:29:00 AM

Local reactions to lifting of advisory

Local residents remain concerned despite the central government's announcement that it will lift an evacuation advisory in Fukushima Prefecture.

Mayor Motohoshi Yamada of Hirono Town, one of the 5 municipalities included in the evacuation advisory, said on Friday the central government appears to be promoting reconstruction plans unilaterally.

He said the central government should first provide local municipalities with guidelines for measuring radiation and carrying out decontamination.

He added that he will request financial assistance from the central government, as it won't be possible to decontaminate the town without state assistance.

A resident of Minamisoma City, which is partly included in the evacuation advisory, said she doesn't feel relieved because the decontamination work has made little progress. The 57-year-old woman said she hopes the city's radiation levels will decline noticeably through the decontamination efforts.

A 61-year-old taxi driver in Minamisoma said business has been bad as many people have left the city. He said he hopes the lifting of the evacuation advisory will encourage residents to return to their homes.

A 36-year-old shop clerk said he doubts that firms will return to the city even after the evacuation advisory is lifted. He said he wants the central government and the operator of the nuclear plant to assume responsibility for decontaminating the city.

Friday, September 30, 2011 15:04 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:31:25 AM

Government looked at terrorist threat to nuclear plants Government planners investigated the risk of terrorists attacking a nuclear power plant in Japan but concluded there was little risk of a release of radioactive substances, according to a secret government report obtained by The Asahi Shimbun. www.asahi.com
by Luisa 9/30/2011 8:31:54 AM

@Luisa idiots !
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:32:38 AM

@Edano yep, I agree, idiots
by Luisa 9/30/2011 8:33:18 AM

imagine, a terrorist attack right now at daiichi....little risk ??? it doesn't need a jumbo jet to do major harm.
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:34:24 AM

Diet panel could seek to pin blame in Fukushima disaster The Diet will set up a panel effectively authorized to clarify responsibility of key individuals in the Fukushima nuclear disaster, such as former Prime Minister Naoto Kan and executives of Tokyo Electric Power Co. www.asahi.com
by Luisa 9/30/2011 8:34:27 AM

they lift evacuation advisory before cleaning the mess up. unbelievable.
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:37:05 AM

@Edano well they had to do it before the compo act comes into force tis the 30/9 today tomoro is OCTOBER
by elainekirk 9/30/2011 8:38:02 AM

@elainekirk oooh yes, you're right. this is criminal.
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:39:08 AM

Nihonmatsu City launches decontamination section

A city office in Fukushima Prefecture has launched a section dedicated exclusively to monitoring and removing radiation discharged from the disaster-stricken nuclear plant.

Nihonmatsu City launched the 6-member section on Friday.

The city is about 50 kilometers from the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant. Relatively high levels of radiation have been detected in parts of the city.

One township recently found radioactive cesium in pre-harvest rice at levels as high as the government's safety limit.

The new section is to measure levels of radioactive substances in soil, well water and crops, and draw up a decontamination plan for the city.

Friday, September 30, 2011 15:04 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp
by Edano 9/30/2011 8:40:36 AM