Japan Earthquake | Page 1045
apologis for the late modding I have been otherwisingby elainekirk 5/8/2011 11:01:51 AM
Hi Elaine pls could you pin Edano's reactor data plots from 1059? TY!by hudebnik 5/8/2011 11:19:49 AM- is that the charts further down hudebnik? (my eyes are useless) could you put just the links in a post because the charts pinned would knock the discussion into the etherby elainekirk 5/8/2011 11:24:34 AM
Good evening folksby bo 5/8/2011 11:29:24 AM- @bo hiby elainekirk 5/8/2011 11:29:49 AM
tweet anybody got validation of this reading
Myrcnan Mat Hill
TEPCO: temp in No 3's been ~80℃; rising in May & suddenly hit 206℃ today. Don't know why but could be "meaningless peak" from thermometer.by elainekirk 5/8/2011 11:37:15 AM- OH my!! the government is allowing the sale of cattle from the evac zone ..
Primary 1 Fukushima: "evacuation area" extraordinary beef cattle auction, in late May
translate.google.com
and those contamination maps
translate.google.comby elainekirk 5/8/2011 11:41:21 AM - Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmby bo 5/8/2011 11:46:59 AM
- any reason the tbs cam is focusing on 1 & 2? the tweet posted below says #3 is very hotby elainekirk 5/8/2011 11:57:30 AM
Unit 3 is 314,5C now, hot...by xxx 5/8/2011 11:58:03 AM- @xxx okkkk I think I will just go get coffee then come back and see if that figure still says what I think it says........by elainekirk 5/8/2011 12:00:46 PM
- here are all temp data for 3: www.tepco.co.jpby xxx 5/8/2011 12:02:31 PM
- yup it still says 314.5c can you say how bad that is @xxx i am not techi enoughby elainekirk 5/8/2011 12:06:35 PM
- @elainekirk temperature is one thing, but also water injection, they increase it 50% from 6 to 9 m^3/h but this doesnt help, 314 is bad because 300 is max reactor limitIt look like corium is melting via RPV... They should add boron to water, but there is no confirmation that they are doing this....by xxx 5/8/2011 12:09:55 PM
- @xxx I remember seeing a doc about boron it seems tepco had been diluting it too much not re this crisis - I wil go see if I can find itby elainekirk 5/8/2011 12:16:32 PM
- So bearing in mind all the smoke etc last night are we seeing evidence of the core melting through ?the RPV into the drywell? If it is now corium it may not be porous enough for boron to have much of an effect.by hudebnik 5/8/2011 12:37:03 PM
- Didn't it seem that the fire was coming from #3 and #4 last night?by bo 5/8/2011 12:38:54 PM
- @bo - especially #3by hudebnik 5/8/2011 12:39:46 PM
- I agree but it seemed like some serious smoke was also coming out of #4by bo 5/8/2011 12:40:22 PM
- Back to #3 temperature I knew boron and #3 rang a bell is it not true that above 300c the boron turns into tetraboric acid meaning their control rods will be shot and it is now a free for all in that reactor?by elainekirk 5/8/2011 12:46:06 PM
@elainekirk Well arent you the bringer of good news..............lolby Angie 5/8/2011 12:47:23 PM
@hudebnik @bo : the heavy steam we saw the last two nights, while by day there is nothing to see. in the past, we often saw residual smoking in the morning. so it seems to me tepco has been doing some action every night since quite a long time and they want to hide it from the anxious public. i would assume it is just water spraying, no fire, no criticality, since they seem to be able to control it.by Edano 5/8/2011 12:50:44 PM- @angie I may be wrong but when this all kicked off in march tepco didnt have any sustainable stock of boron I know S.Korea offered their stock that they could spare but don't know if it was taken up, I saw somewhere at that time that it was only useful up to 300c and after that it changed into tetra....please somebody come along and give a proper explanation cos I don't do techi :)
by elainekirk 5/8/2011 12:50:49 PM - @elainekirk No I think you may just be right, I also remember reading about it. I think France offered as well.by Angie 5/8/2011 12:53:47 PM
- somehow it makes sense: spraying in the night, workers working in the day.by Edano 5/8/2011 12:54:42 PM
- @Edano, cool, thanks. Also, what kind of spraying would explain that much steam? Given current conditions, what could they be spraying, and why is doing it only for half the day smart?by bo 5/8/2011 1:00:00 PM
Q+A: What's going on at Japan's damaged nuclear power plant? TOKYO | Sun May 8, 2011 7:34am EDT www.reuters.comby Debra Beckham 5/8/2011 1:03:14 PM- @bo : i think it seems logical to spray a lot of water at night, while zhe workers rest. you don't want to get them wet, i guess. in daylight they can work without getting wet.by Edano 5/8/2011 1:05:08 PM
- @Edano thanks for the perspective. In terms of systems, my choice is cultural. IBM made computers for decades and the thought never occurred to them that people could use them. They only made them for nuclear war planners and corporations. Don't want to give them a dime.by bo 5/8/2011 1:07:00 PM
@elainekirk France sent 95 tons of Boron early on www.straitstimes.com I don't know if they have been sending more. I know I read something that said this is rare, special Boron, beter at dampening nuclear reactions, but can't find link and don't remember what was so special about it. I do know French Champagne is also special:)by RBeaner 5/8/2011 1:10:53 PM- @Edano truer words may never have been spoken.by bo 5/8/2011 1:12:43 PM
- @rbeaner ty can you help with the 300c ?by elainekirk 5/8/2011 1:12:57 PM
- if i could i would constuct my own computer ;) i just admired and touched that zuse 1 computer and i was fascinated. all mechanical, about 10 m² size. a beautiful thing.by Edano 5/8/2011 1:13:46 PM
- @elainekirk I am looking too but I cant find anything about the temp and boron..............by Angie 5/8/2011 1:13:56 PM
- @bo : domo arigato bo-san.by Edano 5/8/2011 1:14:04 PM
- as to the type of spraying: i would say: excessive spraying, judging by the steam. maybe more pouring than spraying.by Edano 5/8/2011 1:18:45 PM
Anything new in the last 8 hours? Sounds like 3 is heating up again?by Nancy 5/8/2011 1:28:56 PM- @nancy hi difficult to tell cam has been on 1 & 2 whenever I have looked, got to go out soon so hoping you will have lotsa info when I get back :)by elainekirk 5/8/2011 1:32:51 PM
@elainekirk Check out the wiki entry for Corium for some useful info on various melting temps and a summary of corium composition and reactions in a BWR reactor: en.wikipedia.org
"Between 1300–1500°C, the silver-cadmium-indium alloy of control rods melts, together with their cladding and volatile metals evaporate."by es 5/8/2011 1:33:24 PM
@ll Morning. I would point out that Boron has nuetron absorbtion properties and would only be helpful if there were some excess nuetrons to absorb. There's nothing here to imply that, because decay heat is plenty good enough to heat things up.by Jim 5/8/2011 1:33:36 PM- As things melt in the core heat transfer to the outside becomes more limited and I think that's what we're seeing. No fission necessary or required.by Jim 5/8/2011 1:38:52 PM
- Guys I just found this, not sure if its helpful or not............. www.iaea.org HIGH TEMPERATURE STUDY OF THE CONTROL ROD XA0053645
BEHAVIOUR UNDER ACCIDENT CONDITIONSby Angie 5/8/2011 1:39:17 PM - @Jim @elainekirk Different structures of Boron behave better at high temp than others www.google.com on Boron at hi temp. Maybe this is what was "special" about Frances Boron. They also got like 50 Ton of Boron from So Korea, have know clue how much they use.by RBeaner 5/8/2011 1:39:21 PM
- @Nancy Did you see Tenzing's earlier post:
Have you guys seen this video, its a close-up look at the spent-fuel pool in reactor 4. Debris from damage to the building can be seen on top of the fuel rods. There's also what appears to be part of an access ladder. martynwilliams.posterous.com
by Tenzing at 12:35 PMby es 5/8/2011 1:43:08 PM - @ll Decay heat accounts for up to 20% of the energy produced in an operating reactor.by Jim 5/8/2011 1:43:43 PM
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