Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 1623

ty estacion
by dean 6/14/2011 12:15:24 PM

%(__) coffee for lilly.. not the best but elaine is gone for a bit
by dean 6/14/2011 12:16:19 PM

I must head to work, will return around 1 pm... ty all PEACE..
by dean 6/14/2011 12:17:14 PM

@lillymunster Yea, I said yesterday, people on this site (in general, nobody specific) have become to touchy and sensitive. I think it is stress about the ongoing situation and lack of ability to have an impact. But we all need to mellow a little and not get our ire up. Comments are easily taken out of context.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 12:17:31 PM

@dean It was over a month ago we were looking up vests and other cooling here. I shot my contact an email that night with the manual Dean posted and links to the vests and vortecs, and told him what the workers should be complaining about. Sounds like the occupational office was able to put at least some pressure. Seems like the same mentality of "we will do it soon" TEPCo always did with regulators.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:17:31 PM

@RBeaner Yes, I don't appreciate getting attacked for something I have no control over either. :-)
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:18:21 PM

@lillymunster but remember also, that sometimes an "attack" is just frustration coming out with a few taps on a keyboard. If face to face communication was happening, you probably both, and other (many) situations would have ended with hugs and thankyous:):):)
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 12:20:37 PM

@RBeaner ty
by bo 6/14/2011 12:21:40 PM

@RBeaner As far as publishing things, getting your work as a stand alone article in a newspaper, that takes independent journalists an entire career to get something in a major paper. Beat reporters are not going to play press agent and get someone else's paper published or printed. It just doesn't work that way. Give them tips and they will run with it, that is what they need to do their jobs. Getting a paper in a professional journal, if you work in the industry that is fairly straightforward depending on the industry but takes a long time to get to print. If it is something time sensitive it isn't the logical way to get information out fast. Posting something on a website, even not a major one then using the web and social media to push it and make it an issue can force the issue where the media will pick it up.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:22:13 PM

@lillymunster absolutelely agree, for example Bobby1's writeup is perfect for the web. And this group is a non-profit. Info origionating from this group should be free.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 12:24:20 PM

@RBeaner ty, there was someone on the board two days ago that (I guess someone was not happy with and made an "insinuation" that it was me... Why they did that I don't know, if I have something to say I will and I will post it under my name... and if you do think its me then ASK if its me, but don't make an insinuation...
by fitter 6/14/2011 12:24:47 PM

@all hello
by fitter 6/14/2011 12:26:13 PM

@RBeaner That is another issue with journals, they will seriously limit who can read the piece. They either don't put it out to the general public (only journal subscribers) or charge a sometimes high fee to read it. It is a great venue for theoretical or information that has been learned so it can be used in the future.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:26:49 PM

@fitter Most people here are honest about their opinions and intentions. I have seen a number of honest people get accused of some pretty over the top things without any proof and many have up and left over it.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:27:53 PM

@fitter Morn fit...Hey, do you think ANYONE should be surprised at leaks from a brand new system, shipped three tousand miles, and put together as quickly as possible.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 12:28:03 PM

@RBeaner I read bobby's paper, very good work. We need to find out if she/he wants it printed here. Don't want to do something without permission either.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:30:05 PM

@fitter hey there
by bo 6/14/2011 12:30:31 PM

BTW, on the worker thing. Has anyone heard of any US workers actually signing up to go over there and help? I remember one of the US contractor companies had an ad out or was asking nuke workers to sign up to go?
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:30:58 PM

@lillymunster bobby linked it here and pinned at top.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 12:31:02 PM

@lillymunster haven't seen a word about it. I kind of doubt anyone would go unless they had previosly worked over there and new japonese nuke worker conditions and rules.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 12:33:24 PM

Interesting, camera guy is doing a night pan on the jnn feed. Sorry, not able to record this :(
by deb 6/14/2011 12:35:07 PM

@RBeaner Yes, where I found it. Still want to make sure he/she is ok with it before putting it on the site. I think it would make a great piece for the site and it needs to get pushed to other online media & social media. It is about the only easy to understand break down of the radiation I have seen. Everything official just makes people's eyes glaze over and regular media just claims everything is safe.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:36:34 PM

BTW, I am not the only person who can post things to the site. Multiple people have author logins.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 12:37:04 PM

@deb have you got the tbs link please
by elainekirk 6/14/2011 12:37:33 PM

by deb 6/14/2011 12:37:54 PM

by deb 6/14/2011 12:38:37 PM

"What I'm after is to make this dataset available to the scientific community," says Wolfgang Weiss, head of the department of radiation protection and health at Germany's Federal Office for Radiation Protection in Munich. In the coming weeks and months he hopes to persuade member nations overseeing the CTBTO to approve new rules for sharing data with other international bodies and scientific researchers. www.nature.com
by elainekirk 6/14/2011 12:38:48 PM

arrrr, that was not supposed to happen. Link straight link did the embed, sorry
by deb 6/14/2011 12:39:10 PM

@deb that is great ty
by elainekirk 6/14/2011 12:40:34 PM

www.asahicom.jp
The size of the cover 47 meters length, 42 meters width, 54 meters high. 14, published a model. Exposure of workers (nuked), spontaneous people to work in the workplace in order to reduce, by applying the method of Japanese architecture, and assembled without bolts.
translate.google.com
by elainekirk via Asahicom.jp 6/14/2011 12:46:20 PM

@elainekirk good article, but Thousands of individuals must have access to that data, seems like an immediate rush job for wikileaks.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 12:46:57 PM

The reason Tepco have been ordered to release workers from duty whose internal exposure is over 100milliserves is because the external exposure when added takes them over 250 milliserves
I am not going to say that yet again tepco have played with figures to downplay the situation I will just think it out loud
by elainekirk 6/14/2011 12:52:51 PM

@RBeaner good moring.... I think that they are happy if they only had ten leaks, and that they are making such progress.... they don't say if its a drip, "puddle" etc... the lead time in just procuing the items needed to build it are a long lead time, and it can't be ordered until they have designed it.... We pay 3000.00 dollars for a valve that is normally 1,200. ... because we need it NOW..... we have a vendor in Texas with shelves of "stainless steel" blocks that had the necessary MTR"S .... we call, they run the shop 24/7 ... but its very tedeious.. I would have to track it 24 hours a day... to make sure it made the next plane... We have bought a "seat" on a plane in the past.... its faster than frteight ... but very expenseve.. I think they are doing a great job... and I am glad to see the progression... hope it works... but suspect as any thing designed and built that fast will have hic-ups...
by fitter 6/14/2011 12:56:38 PM

@elainekirk FYI I understand that the board has little experience in "constructabilty", so this is only to infrom some how construction works.... when a job, high rise is built, they (the insurance companies do a risk assecment, and project how many injuries and deaths will happen.. naturaly they hope for the best, but that is not reality... the last high rise I worked it was estimated 5 would be killed... there had been two or three by the time I left... the process is very complex (before everyone start the usual jumping on me) it goes by many factors.. company history, number of floors, complexeity of design...etc... I believe one of the best was the facts from the Empire State building in NY...
by fitter 6/14/2011 1:04:46 PM

@elainekirk aLL i'M SAYING (DOWN BELOW) IS THAT THE ARTICLE DOESN'T SAY THEIR COMBINED IS GREATER THAN 250 MsV. iT MAY BE, WE HAVEN'T BEEN GIVEN THAT DATA...YET:)
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 1:05:45 PM

@elainekirk Sorry about caps, fat fingers and didn't review....SORRY:0
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 1:07:09 PM

s4.reutersmedia.net
Three-quarters of Japanese favor nuclear power phase-out
www.reuters.com
by elainekirk 6/14/2011 1:07:59 PM

@rbeaner rofl I thought I was the only person who did that :)
by elainekirk 6/14/2011 1:10:35 PM

@elainekirk , I have been scrolling backward and I am up to date on the discussion. As to radiation safety. First thought: The workers with the greatest doses absorbed in March and April may be the crew that had to go near the reactors to vent the vessels. I simply imagined that the valves that must be turned manually are equipped with very long stems and perhaps end in a shielded location. I may be wrong. Perhaps fitter knows. I have difficulty believing that those two guys with high thyroid doses inhaled the stuff in the control room. How about the others in there at the time? This is an unlikely explanation for where their contamination happened. My next thought is that they still pay way to little attention to occupational health. As to thyroid radioactivity which may be most pressing, every nuclear medicine department in a hospital is equipped to determine iodine radioactivity in the thyroid. Iodine-131 is used to treat thyroid cancer. A whole body counter is not necessary for this. The workers should have whole body counts perhaps once a month to monitor low level and distributed incorporations. For this kind of check they could be sent anywhere in Japan. They should have their feces analyzed for alpha and beta contamination on a regular basis, perhaps once a week. Too little seems to be done in this respect. Third idea every child in Japan should wear a little film badge dosimeter. This means a huge public health effort, but would create a greater sense of communality and of joining hands to achieve something positive than we all must sit down now and chow the mildly radioactive food until its gone.
by Peter Melzer 6/14/2011 1:12:07 PM

@elainekirk It sounds like they will have more and more workers flagged for over limit doses. They still have to body scan most of them. As information comes out, what was going on in those first days was utter chaos. People were not wearing respirators in some cases before the blasts or before they realized there was radiation leaking. Dosimeters were limited or not used and the body scanning machines at the plants were not usable.
The guys that went and cleaned up debris around 3 without any radiation detection equipment is just horribly sad but it was chaos and they had to get equipment in. Nobody had a clue at that point how radioactive the rubble was.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 1:16:09 PM

Ex-SKF picked up the steam event from yesterday. He seems to have some contacts in Japan with experts. Hoping he might find out what the deal is with these. ex-skf.blogspot.com
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 1:21:46 PM

Can someone with more understanding of reading these radiation graphs take a look at this. Someone commented on ex-skf that this graph shows radiation peaks at the same time as yesterday's steam show. guregoro.sakura.ne.jp
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 1:25:58 PM

@lillymunster Your'e mixing different issues on exposure. "The guys that went and cleaned up debris around 3 without any radiation detection equipment ".. This one is new. He had everything he was supposed to, except he fogot to put a filter cartridge in the mask he was wearing.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 1:28:54 PM

@lillymunster on the ex-skf, the headline "6 more workers exceeded 250 mSv limit" has not been reported (yet). Maybe they did, but the article says "The Ministry of Health, Labor and Welfare announced on June 13 that 6 additional workers at Fukushima I Nuclear Power Plant may have exceeded the radiation exposure limit of 250 millisieverts." key word (to me) being May.
by RBeaner 6/14/2011 1:34:51 PM

@RBeaner Different incidents. The guy with no filter was another worker. There is also the batch of workers that cleared rubble. They are still waiting for their body scans and are concerned about their health after finding out how radioactive that rubble might have been.
by lillymunster 6/14/2011 1:35:56 PM