Japan Earthquake | Page 2288

  • Tepco plans to flood reactors, extract fuel search.japantimes.co.jp
    by Mid Valley 9/1/2011 5:18:08 AM

  • "(Reuters) - The earthquake that shook the U.S. East Coast last week rattled huge, heavy casks holding radioactive nuclear waste at a Virginia plant, moving them as much as 4.5 inches (11 cm) from their original position, the plant's operator has said. [...] "They remained upright and fully intact." " www.reuters.com
    by Ian 9/1/2011 6:35:45 AM

  • The reactor-meltdown diagrams seen half-way through this new in-Japanese video are interesting, seems to outline a plan to extract corium : www.youtube.com
    by Ian 9/1/2011 7:44:01 AM

  • @Ian search.japantimes.co.jp
    Tokyo Electric Power Co. said Wednesday that it plans to remove the melted nuclear fuel from inside the crippled reactors at the Fukushima No. 1 power plant after repairing the reactor containers and filling them with water.
    But the utility did not give further details, only saying the plan, unveiled during a meeting of a government panel on nuclear energy policy, is just "at a concept stage at the moment."
    by elainekirk 9/1/2011 8:13:23 AM

  • @elainekirk, it sounds like a pipe dream! And the report closes saying it may be problematic because "'advanced technological development' will likely be required."
    by Ian 9/1/2011 8:37:39 AM

  • www.houseoffoust.com
    www.houseoffoust.com
    @Ian voilá, avec data points.

    by Edano via Houseoffoust 9/1/2011 9:16:55 AM

  • www.houseoffoust.com
    www.houseoffoust.com
    @Ian voilá, avec data points.

    by Edano via Houseoffoust 9/1/2011 9:16:55 AM

  • anybody understand this from a worker (translated)
    When the No. 3 blast, GM tube was put into a Geiger counter this hate Opefuro #
    by elainekirk 9/1/2011 9:37:23 AM

  • this turns up time and time again for #6 www.tepco.co.jp

    - At 10:00 am on September 1, we started transferring accumulated water
    from the turbine building of Unit 6 to a temporary tank.
    by elainekirk 9/1/2011 9:45:00 AM

  • @Ian If you click on the red " CC " button on the bottom right of the player you get legends in any language you like :-)

    by Majj 9/1/2011 10:16:48 AM

  • @Ian Has to be on the YouTube page only .... The embed below do not show the button
    by Majj 9/1/2011 10:18:32 AM

  • Hospital exposes children to excessive amounts of radioactive agent

    KOFU, Japan, Sept. 1, Kyodo

    A hospital in central Japan's Yamanashi Prefecture said Thursday it had administered higher-than-recommended doses of a radioactive substance to 84 children undergoing examinations since 1999, but that no health hazard from radiation exposure had so far been reported.

    Kofu Municipal Hospital said a test agent containing radioactive technetium was intravenously injected into 145 children aged 15 or under to examine the functioning of their internal organs, and that 84 of them received dosages in excess of the amount recommended by the Japanese Society of Nuclear Medicine.

    Among such children, one was administered an amount more than 20 times the recommended dosage, the hospital said.
    english.kyodonews.jp
    by Edano 9/1/2011 10:29:59 AM

  • uuups ??
    by Edano 9/1/2011 10:30:06 AM

  • URGENT: Fujimura to be Japan's chief Cabinet secretary: DPJ source

    TOKYO, Sept. 1, Kyodo

    Japan's incoming Prime Minister Yoshihiko Noda decided Thursday to appoint Osamu Fujimura, one of the closest allies of Noda in the ruling Democratic Party of Japan, as chief Cabinet secretary.

    Fujimura, acting secretary general of the DPJ, told reporters that he has accepted Noda's request to take up the post of chief Cabinet secretary, who serves as Japan's top government spokesman.

    Noda is aiming to form his Cabinet on Friday, according to a DPJ source.
    english.kyodonews.jp
    by Edano 9/1/2011 10:34:24 AM

  • :(
    by Edano 9/1/2011 10:34:27 AM

  • Atmospheric dispersion of radionuclides from the Fukushima-Daichii nuclear power plant . cerea.enpc.fr
    by Majj 9/1/2011 11:00:08 AM

  • @Peter Melzer Good morning and WOW!! The NHK myth-buster programme certainly clarifies many many things for me - a thousand thanks for that. Now this may seem an odd and terribly controversial thing to say, but my earlier fears about the teams of workers tasked to vent have gone. Despite all the ill-informed or misleading reports to the contrary, I don't think there's any concern to be had about the workers forced to manually open the vents - I can find no evidence that any of the venting that took place was manually executed by anyone. If you (or anyone) find some solid facts to the contrary please let me know. I'm convinced our new perspective gives us far greater explanatory powers here. I admit I haven't yet cross-checked every event to confirm the timings, but consider that all the emissions that left the plant have done so under their own steam, so to speak.

    In the immediate aftermath of the disaster, when containment was first breached and high-rad gases were being released from Unit 1 reactor, TEPCO made a request to the Japanese government to the effect that they wanted permission to vent should reactor pressures rise to dangerous levels. Permission was duly granted. Despite this top-level authorisation, and apparently in defiance of the govt's later instruction to do so immediately, no action to vent was taken. Why not? Well it simply wasn't needed and would've caused unnecessary harm. TEPCO realised this, and this was why they rightly refused to send their workers into the highly contaminated buildings to manually vent the containment vessels. In fact, by the early hours of 12th March, I`m convinced that everyone concerned in the decision-making process - including the Nuclear Safety Commission who were advising Kan's govt - knew and correctly predicted that venting now would not prevent the meltdowns in any sense, and that explosions due to hydrogen were highly unlikely.

    What I believe the NSC did recognise this early on, however, was that a venting story would help cover-up the fact that radioactive material had breached containment of its own accord - this would have beeb a much more serious state of affairs to explain away. The high levels of radiation from such a severe accident would be obviously detectable and it was clear people had to be evacuated from the immediate surroundings as quickly and as calmly as possible. So, in brief, I'm not saying that venting didn't occur - it most obviously did - but beware of conflicting uses of the term 'venting'. From the evidence amassed thus far, I don't believe any of those recorded venting events were planned and scheduled by workers in the sense of them deciding and undertaking to open or close anything manually; they were all naturally occurring breaches and vents - the result of vessel penetrations and the subsequent melt-thrus that followed. By all means prove this analysis wrong, but that's why I don't think you should worry about those particular workers. :)
    by es 9/1/2011 11:28:16 AM

  • @All hi! The outer cloud bands of Talas have begun crossing the Japanese mainland, winds remain pretty low ahead of the system, some heavy yet sporadic rainfalls have occurred in the last 24 hours some totaling over 200mm+ for a handful of stations @ 1700JST(0800UTC)(link: agora.ex.nii.ac.jp ). Talas has again failed to strength significantly in the last 24 hours, the system still lies under difficult upper atmospheric conditions but this doesn’t overly change the forecast. The track continues to be revised in a generally westerly trend but has been revised easterly also, most indicated forecast tracks place the system crossing over Osaka or within a few hundred kilometers, the centre will most likely pass west of Osaka. Models continue to predict inconsistently falls totaling over 200mm+ for large areas of Japan associated with the system crossing, JMA has warnings/advisories for most Japanese prefectures (link: www.jma.go.jp ), JMA also has a sea wave map forecast available here: www.data.kishou.go.jp , it will be updated in around an hour in relation to Talas. Here's the MSAT of Nth west pacific showing Talas beginning to affect Japan. Link: www.ssd.noaa.gov . The systems effects will begin to become far more evident over the next 12 hours as the system edges closer and the stronger area of the storm begins to cross the coast. For anyone who uses sat images at different frequencies to see storm structure, also available wind and rain passes. www.nrlmry.navy.mil
    by Thunder 9/1/2011 11:33:56 AM

  • @es what are you referring to, please ?
    by Edano 9/1/2011 11:38:27 AM

  • accidental venting thru the stack ? how's that possible ?
    by Edano 9/1/2011 11:39:55 AM

  • @Edano Peter posted this link yesterday, when I was enquiring about the venting events at Daiichi: www.nippon-sekai.com
    We were both concerned about the doses workers carrying out such procedures would have gotten.
    by es 9/1/2011 11:41:23 AM

  • @Edano Maybe something was broken :(
    by es 9/1/2011 11:42:05 AM

  • Morning!
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 11:46:09 AM

  • an accidental venting is even more frightening than a controlled one.
    by Edano 9/1/2011 11:46:14 AM

  • @ES, I remember a mainstream JP media source in March/April talking about sending workers in to try to manually open the vents by dragging batteries or air tanks in. I will keep an eye out for where it showed up. Because it was printed doesn't make it 100% true. We know how much chaos and misinformation was going on early on.
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 11:48:06 AM

  • Reading Ian's post earlier this morning. Did they ever remove the remaining corium from Chernobyl?
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 11:55:18 AM

  • @lillymunster Thanks. Any data is valuable here - any inaccuracies in the stories will likely be obvious.
    by es 9/1/2011 11:55:42 AM

  • @es I will keep an eye out as I go through the old content on the site, we might have a link to the documents. I wondered the same thing when they claimed workers went in to manually vent. They would have to get a massive dose. Yet we have no reports of additional workers with heavy exposures.
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 11:58:06 AM

  • Today's roll your eyes laugh from the Agora Cosmopolitan: "David Icke suggests that Manipulative Extraterrestrials who have infiltrated human institutions are behind Fukushima's nuclear disaster."
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 12:01:07 PM

  • 80% think govt is not being honest www.google.com
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 12:02:34 PM

  • good morning, es, according to the NHK documentary, Kan's office order venting of unit 1, and with that they meant the hardened venting of the dry well, on Friday night. It took Tepco until the next morning to execute. What was the reason for the delay? By Friday night even DC power was out. The valves could not be actuated from the control room. The documentary explains that Tepco crew did not know by heart where the valves were located. They had to scramble for blue prints. The valves need at least DC to be actuated. Some also need hydraulic or pneumatic support. Crew had to carry car batteries, maybe bottles of compressed air. Kan arrived on the Saturday morning in person to check on the progress (by comparison Jimmy Carter's visit to TMI occurred much later after the Office of the President was assured that there was no danger anymore). Another reason, tepco's hypothesis on the explosions hinges entirely on the idea that hardened venting filled the building with hydrogen.
    by Peter Melzer 9/1/2011 12:15:21 PM

  • @Lilly read debris removal section, the corium mass is still in chernobyl known as the elephants foot. en.wikipedia.org
    by Thunder 9/1/2011 12:15:46 PM

  • order = ordered, ;)
    by Peter Melzer 9/1/2011 12:16:14 PM

  • MidValley posted this over on Organize. Fuel casks at North Anna shifted in quake. blogs.fredericksburg.com
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 12:33:41 PM

  • @Peter Melzer Thanks. These are my observations on your points:

    1. "according to the NHK documentary, Kan's office order venting of unit 1, and with that they meant the hardened venting of the dry well, on Friday night"
    Fine, I can underestand this may have been an initial concern, i.e. this decision was based on information provided AT AN EARLY STAGE.

    2. "The documentary explains that Tepco crew did not know by heart where the valves were located. They had to scramble for blue prints. The valves need at least DC to be actuated. Some also need hydraulic or pneumatic support. Crew had to carry car batteries, maybe bottles of compressed air."
    Yes, I can see there were numerous mountains to climb but still I'm having difficulty believing all the details here. By 9PM radioactive material was known to be escaping containment - rad levels were so high that workers were instructed not to enter the building. I don't yet know quite what went on with trying to fix up the power trucks - either the power system was faulty before they tried to connect the trucks, or they damaged it in the process. But that's something else.

    3."Kan arrived on the Saturday morning in person to check on the progress (by comparison Jimmy Carter's visit to TMI occurred much later after the Office of the President was assured that there was no danger anymore)."
    Yes, and based on what they knew about the status of all three reactors he would have been foolish to leave it any later. Big-up for the dude :)

    4."Another reason, tepco's hypothesis on the explosions hinges entirely on the idea that hardened venting filled the building with hydrogen."
    Yes, this hypothesis is being challenged here.
    by es 9/1/2011 12:34:01 PM

  • Es, trovato! Timeline table for unit 1 in the NISA report ( fukushima.grs.de ), p IV-49, lists for Saturday, Mar. 12:
    9:04: Workers left for the site for pressure venting.
    ca. 9:15: Suppression chamber vent line motor-operated (MO) valve was manually opened (25%).
    ca. 9:30: Suppression chamber vent line air-operated (AO, second valve) valve was attempted but given up because of its too high radioactive dosage.
    by Peter Melzer 9/1/2011 12:42:29 PM

  • It may not be simple to judge, if Kan's order to vent made things worse in the end. But it is obvious that tepco leaders attempt to unload some responsibility for the explosions onto the government with their hypothesis that the venting backfilled the buildings with gas. The professorial hypothesis in the CNIC meeting may equally valid suggesting that primary containment gaskets blew releasing the gas.
    by Peter Melzer 9/1/2011 12:50:18 PM

  • @Peter Melzer Kan followed the advice given by the NSC.
    by es 9/1/2011 12:52:37 PM

  • The two workers, now a 3rd soaked with radioactive water. TEPCO advises to wear raincoats. One had .89 mSv external radiation found in his wet clothes. www.asahi.com
    by lillymunster 9/1/2011 12:55:51 PM

  • @es, I am sure he did not take a solemn decision. Still, it was quite courageous of him to visit the site in person the next day and check up on the situation. I wonder whether he was accompanied by tepco seniors on this trip. Did not their most senior leader immediately develop a heart problem?
    by Peter Melzer 9/1/2011 12:59:02 PM

  • Re: early worker irradiation: We are implementing a measure to reduce the pressure of the reactor
    containment vessels,
    but, one of our employees working in the Unit 1 was irradiated at over
    100mSv level(106.3mSv). Because of absence of industrial physician, so he
    will be diagnosed at a later day. www.tepco.co.jp y personal opinion is that he was sent to manual vent.
    by M.I.A. 9/1/2011 1:08:21 PM

  • That was a 1:00pm status report from Mar12.
    by M.I.A. 9/1/2011 1:09:42 PM

  • @Peter Melzer I realise it's a long shot, but after five months intensive study of TEPCO-ese, I can see there's another possible interpretation to the unusual entry you site for Unit 1 that morning.
    "9:04: Workers left for the site for pressure venting."
    My warped mind reads this as saying uncontrolled and pressurized venting was occurring and workers had to get out of there fast - an explosion was imminent. If there was a hole in the reactor vessel and gases were spewing out under pressure, perhaps they did think to attempt to vent. Perhaps this was their single and most logical attempt to mitigate the impact of the blast that was shortly to follow? And mayber the worker M.I.A. has just picked up on was the brave man who had to carry out this desperate task.
    by es 9/1/2011 1:26:40 PM

  • Speaking of TEPCO-ese, I find the lack of the statement "Currently, we do not believe there is any reactor coolant leakage inside
    the reactor containment vessel." in the status report on #1 and #2 rather interesting, as it is included on #3 and #4. www.tepco.co.jp
    by M.I.A. 9/1/2011 1:30:28 PM

  • Sorry, that was the 11:00am Mar 12 report.
    by M.I.A. 9/1/2011 1:31:38 PM

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