Japan Earthquake | Page 2385

  • good horror story read. Court order prevents former hospital people from looking for radiation source. Guard goes sick to watch Herbie goes bananas. Scavenger sells it to scrapman who lets his daughter eat on top of some of it, and it gets worse after that. en.wikipedia.org
    by artnuke 9/21/2011 11:27:12 PM

  • @Edano the manual talks about beyond design basis that involve a critical pipe break LOCA or a station blackout plus LOCA. They pretty much say the Mark 1 BWR is doomed due to design flaws. This is without adding in tsunamis, sea water injection and 9.0 earthquakes. It does talk about the standard event scenarios putting connections into the RPV and containment at risk just due to heat etc.
    by lillymunster 9/21/2011 11:28:23 PM

  • NRC announces public meeting on North Anna plant www2.dailyprogress.com I wish I could go. But on exactly that afternoon, I must attend to something else and can't get out of it. I hope there will be a transcript.
    by Peter 9/21/2011 11:37:18 PM

  • @Peter you should be in luck they do like their transcripts www.google.co.uk
    by elainekirk 9/21/2011 11:40:24 PM

  • @Peter if that is the one being held in Virginia it is a teleconference and Dean said he can order a transcript after the meeting.
    by lillymunster 9/21/2011 11:41:56 PM

  • another busby skeptic nextbigfuture.com Either Busby's spot on, or he's a kook/disinformation agent, and I'm getting the feeling it's the latter.
    by artnuke 9/21/2011 11:50:15 PM

  • @lillymunster , I don't know which one Dean meant. The meeting is supposed to be convened at the plant on Oct. 3 in the afternoon. I watched the meeting in Rockville three times now and am still finding things of note.
    by Peter 9/21/2011 11:52:45 PM

  • @Edano I just ran across that, see my top 10. Cesium is much worse than iodine, it will kill you if you come across enough of it. But I just don't see any evidence that a contaminated playground, hamburger, tea or livining an an area at the Chernobyl level of contamination killed anybody or even caused cancer due to cesium exposure which seems to be 99% of the problem right now that's got everybody scared to death.
    by artnuke 9/21/2011 11:55:03 PM

  • @artnuke how do you want to tell if a cancer is caused by cesium ?
    by Edano 9/21/2011 11:56:45 PM

  • Busby: Hundreds of millions of deaths due to cesium: So who is right? Busby or the evidence that low-level radiation didn't kill anybody in Chernobyl or Fukushima? www.examiner.com
    Fukushima nuclear power plant radiation recordings of external gamma radiation have been so high this week, they went off scale said veteran nuclear expert Arnie Gunderson on Thursday after the famous physicist, Dr. Chris Busby told the Japanese people this week that radioactive air contamination there is now 300 times that of Chernobyl and 1000 times the atomic bomb peak in 1963, inferring that hundreds of millions of people are now dying from Fukushima radiation, including people in the United States Experts: Fukushima 'off-scale' lethal radiation level infers millions dying
    by artnuke 9/21/2011 11:57:26 PM

  • 25 million Indian children killed due to radiation. So says Leuren Moret. The intentional dumping of high levels of dangerous nuclear radiation into the Pacific ocean, to be distributed by the great conveyer belt currents was foreshadowed by the intentional targeting of India with the nuclear radiation from the Sellafield (UK) nuclear power plant. The ocean-born radiation from Sellafield has led to the deaths of 25 million Indian children, Ms. Moret states
    gramercyimages.com
    by artnuke 9/21/2011 11:58:39 PM

  • would it be an idea if we keep this page technical and move debate to organise it isn't really working having two conversations going ??
    by elainekirk 9/21/2011 11:59:25 PM

  • @artnuke , Busby is a snake oil vendor.
    by Peter 9/21/2011 11:59:31 PM

  • @Edano Seems that the only thing that sticks around long enough to cause a cancer is going to be cesium. Iodine only causes thyroid cancer. All you have to do is show tons of cancer deaths, and it's going to be from the cesium, isn't that the main thing that's causing most of the radiation measuremens outside the plant?
    by artnuke 9/22/2011 12:00:35 AM

  • smoking causes cancer as well.
    by Edano 9/22/2011 12:01:20 AM

  • @Peter Busby is snake oil vendor. Exactly my point, Moret is worse. Nobody else is predicting millions of deaths, so claims like this need to be shot down.
    by artnuke 9/22/2011 12:01:36 AM

  • @Edano Biggest problem at fuku and chernobyl is mental health. Alchohol probabaly causes cancer too. Suicide is also fatal, but nobody is counting those as radiation related, along with the neglected patients who died, 50-100 of them in the opening days.
    by artnuke 9/22/2011 12:02:45 AM

  • what needs to happen is that people are given facts , not supposition , not scare stories, not 'smile and you will be saved' but facts .
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:05:37 AM

  • @artnuke stronium, plutonium etc. there are lots of other things being found in Japan that cause cancer.
    by lillymunster 9/22/2011 12:13:26 AM

  • by M.I.A. via I1207.photobucket edited by lillymunster 9/22/2011 12:17:15 AM

  • I am counting 5 cranes around #1??
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:25:28 AM

  • back and hello to all
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:27:51 AM

  • @elainekirk tepco or tbs?
    by lillymunster 9/22/2011 12:32:27 AM

  • tbs
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:32:59 AM


  • NUCLEAR DATA
    FOR THE CALCULATION OF
    THERMAL REACTOR REACTIVITY COEFFICIENT

    www-nds.iaea.org
    Wow this will keep the number crunchers here busy
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:33:47 AM

  • @elainekirk I see it. Moved all of them over there and TEPCO cam is down. Wonder if something happened.

    @Dean Hi!
    by lillymunster 9/22/2011 12:34:33 AM

  • looks like a big erector set of cranes..
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:35:20 AM

  • @ elaine and @ lilly.. hows the BWR simulator training coming.. :)
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:36:16 AM

  • @lillymunster I would say so, rockhopper says all is calm and has been for a good few hrs I think the cam is turned off rather than faulty
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:36:22 AM

  • @elainekirk The cranes don't seem to be doing anything.

    @Dean, haven't started on it, still finishing the BWR document in between a few things. I will probably be ready to run my first plant tomorrow. :-)
    by lillymunster 9/22/2011 12:39:27 AM

  • @dean I tell you I am already certifiable :)
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:41:06 AM

  • interesting physics paper @elaine
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:41:37 AM

  • lol @ lilly and elaine
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:41:50 AM

  • @lilly and @elaine.. maybe tomorrow or the next day we can have our first nuclear physics basics for reactors... the 6 FACTOR formula is the standard for describing what goes on in a reactor core...
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:42:53 AM

  • i guess the steel construction collapsed.
    by Edano 9/22/2011 12:43:03 AM

  • the 6 factor formula is the neutron life cycle balance equation
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:44:01 AM

  • @ Edano do you think it did for real?
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:44:13 AM

  • The "Six-factor formula" is the neutron life-cycle balance equation, which includes six separate factors, the product of which is equal to the ratio of the number of neutrons in any generation to that of the previous one; this parameter is called the effective multiplication factor (k), a.k.a. Keff. k = LfρLthfηЄ, where Lf = "fast non-leakage factor"; ρ = "resonance escape probability"; Lth = "thermal non-leakage factor"; f = "thermal fuel utilization factor"; η = "reproduction factor"; Є = "fast-fission factor".

    k = (Neutrons produced in one generation)/(Neutrons produced in the previous generation) When the reactor is critical, k = 1. When the reactor is subcritical, k < 1. When the reactor is supercritical, k > 1.
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:45:23 AM

  • @dean there was a quake about the time the teppy cam first went down my money is on the ground under the construction moving
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:45:41 AM

  • one waving panel could possibly destroy the balance.
    by Edano 9/22/2011 12:45:51 AM

  • @dean you just totally lost me but have you seen the doc I posted re reactivity(recriticality) lots of lovely numbers in there for you
    by elainekirk 9/22/2011 12:46:47 AM

  • true Edano.. if they had one or partial panels up they act as huge sails and with the wind force acting over that square footage it just may be enough to topple it
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:46:54 AM

  • @ elaine.. all those numbers makes my head hurt whewwwwww... that class was a long time ago....
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:47:43 AM

  • Some info from the September report of NISA to IAEA:
    "For Unit 1, as of August 31, water injection has been carried out with the amount of water about 3.6m3/h, which exceeds the amount of water injection equivalent to decay heat.
    Temperature of the bottom of the RPV … stayed under 100°C, and the reactor has been …cooled sufficiently by means of a reactor water injection system (Figure II-2-28).
    In Unit 1, on April 7, the injection of nitrogen into the PCV was started (Figure II-2-29), and it is still ongoing as of August 31.
    Furthermore, following the calibration of the water level gauge conducted in May, the reference leg side of the reactor water level gauge (fuel range A system) has been filled with water. A temporary pressure gauge was installed, and it has started monitoring the reactor water level as well as reactor pressure from reading pressure values and hydraulic head. Monitoring has been continuously carried out to date (Figure II-2-30).
    For Unit 2, as of August 31, water injection has been carried out with the amount of water about 3.8m3/h which exceeds … Temperature of the bottom of the RPV … stayed under 130°C, and the reactor has been …cooled sufficiently by reactor water injection system (Figure II-2-31).
    In Unit 2, on June 28, the injection of nitrogen into the PCV was started (Figure II-2-32), and it is still ongoing as of August 31.
    Furthermore, with regard to the measures carried out after June, a temporary pressure gauge was installed as the same configuration of Unit 1 on June 22. It was estimated that reactor water level was - 5m or less from the TAF, the same estimation as that of Unit 1, but TEPCO recognizes that it is not possible to correctly measure it at this point."
    by Peter 9/22/2011 12:48:16 AM

  • the paper, among other things talked of the temperature coeffecient for reactivity... reactors generally have either a positive temp coefficient or negative so when the temp is increased reactor power will go up.. or down
    by dean 9/22/2011 12:48:33 AM

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