Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 1778

@AustralianCannonball sensless point?. No, can we talk on the other board for a minute?
by RBeaner 6/28/2011 11:54:20 AM

@rbeaner OK
by AustralianCannonball 6/28/2011 11:54:40 AM

The only new on nebraska this morning has been repeated claims calhoun is safe with no details to back it up. Any major news on fuku overnight?
by lillymunster 6/28/2011 11:57:36 AM

tweet Discovered: TEPCO didnt report data on 3.11 to the Nuclear Safety Agency which suggested the hydrogen explosion at R1 happening the next day
by elainekirk 6/28/2011 11:57:56 AM

@lillymunster I have taken to tweetdom and my collection of reliable tweeters no news anywhere
by elainekirk 6/28/2011 11:58:34 AM

@lillymunster I think we are gonna have problems sourcing news because a wildfire threatenede nuke arms base, A flooded npp and fuku all hitting the newstands will harm the image of the favoured
by elainekirk 6/28/2011 12:00:18 PM

Thanks elaine. We will probably have to dig for info.
by lillymunster 6/28/2011 12:01:16 PM

Elaine smoss is stuck in mod. I can't hit the tiny approve button using my phone
by lillymunster 6/28/2011 12:12:24 PM

@all Very Interesting...The original clip covering Ft Calhoun containing much more plant footage. This new video, up on the TBS/JNN youtube site appears to be a shortened/adjusted version of the one I posted last night.
by smoss 6/28/2011 12:14:47 PM

@all Have to post and run...Best wishes to all!
by smoss 6/28/2011 12:14:58 PM

@all TBS/JNN discussing water re-circulation/de-contamination
by smoss 6/28/2011 12:15:02 PM

@all Popping in briefly to re-post a few videos...TBS/JNN set a new land speed record last night for removing their videos!
by smoss 6/28/2011 12:15:06 PM

@elaine. I did some photo review over the weekend looking for more sign of the fissures. I didn't find much on those. I did notice thing at the plant were noticably crooked. Starting in april photos. So maybe some slow settling due to the fissures?
by lillymunster 6/28/2011 12:22:58 PM

www3.nhk.or.jp

TEPCO shareholders pressure utility management

The management of Tokyo Electric Power Company has come under severe criticism from shareholders over its handling of the accident at its Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant.

The utility's shareholders meeting was held in Tokyo on Tuesday morning. The meeting was attended by over 9,300 shareholders, nearly 6,000 more than the record number of participants set last year.

President Masataka Shimizu opened the meeting with an apology for the leak of radioactive materials outside the plant, saying it has caused severe problems such as mass evacuations. He also apologized for the company's net loss of more than 1.2 trillion yen, or about15 billion dollars, in its settlement for the fiscal year that ended in March.

During the question and answer session, shareholders attacked the management's responsibility.

One person said critics had been pointing out the dangers of the Fukushima plant for some time, and asked how management would take responsibility for the reactors' meltdown.

Another said the utility had been causing trouble with its nuclear power generation and that accidents could happen again unless management practices are changed.

The meeting later adopted, as proposed, the utility's agenda proposals including the elections of directors.

Meanwhile, a proposal by more than 400 shareholders to have the utility's corporate rules stipulate a withdrawal from nuclear power generation was voted down.
At the meeting, motions to dismiss the chair of the meeting -- the chairman of the utility Tsunehisa Katsumata -- were proposed but were voted down. Supporters of the proposals said there are problems with the proceedings of the meeting, which ended after a record 6 hours, more than twice that of last year.

Tuesday, June 28, 2011 20:38 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp
by Edano via Www3.nhk.or.jp 6/28/2011 12:24:32 PM

www3.nhk.or.jp

TEPCO starts covering No.1 reactor building

The operator of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant has begun building a giant polyester shield over the damaged Number 1 reactor building to contain the spread of radiation.

One of the largest cranes in Japan has been brought to the site for the construction. It has a 140 meter-long arm that can lift up to 750 tons.

The crane will be used to install a fabric cover around the reactor building. Before that, it will be used to remove debris from the top of the building, which was shattered by a hydrogen explosion one day after the earthquake and tsunami on March 11th.

Tokyo Electric Power Company says that when the shield is installed, the entire structure will be about 54 meters high.

Meanwhile, offsite at Onahama Port about 50 kilometers from the nuclear plant, the utility is preassembling 62 steel components that will be joined to create a rigid frame. The frame will support one millimeter-thick polyester fiber panels.

The components will start arriving at the plant in July. Work to assemble them will be done by the crane. The utility says the process will minimize the number of workers who must spend time at the site and lessen their radioactive exposure. TEPCO hopes to complete the cover by late September.

Tuesday, June 28, 2011 20:07 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp
by Edano via Www3.nhk.or.jp 6/28/2011 12:26:22 PM

TEPCO injects nitrogen into No.2 reactor

The Tokyo Electric Power Company began injecting nitrogen into the containment vessel of the No.2 reactor at the Fukushima nuclear plant on Tuesday night to prevent hydrogen explosions.

Hydrogen is generated when water in the reactor comes in contact with radiation. It's believed that hydrogen is building up inside the containment vessel.

As the reactor continues to be cooled, reaction between hydrogen and oxygen can result in an explosion, in the worst case scenario.

The utility firm has been pumping nitrogen into the No.1 reactor. But there's no knowing yet when it can start doing so at the No.3 reactor, because the plumbing work for nitrogen injections cannot be undertaken due to high-level radiation inside the reactor.

According to a roadmap to contain the crisis at the plant, the work of injecting nitrogen into the 3 reactors is scheduled to be complete by July 17th.

The spokesman for the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, Hidehiko Nishiyama, says the current situation is severe but workers at the plant will do their best to achieve the target on the roadmap.

Tuesday, June 28, 2011 20:39 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp
by Edano 6/28/2011 12:27:58 PM

@lillymunster I will keep looking I have been trawling for documented evidence multi tasking atm but will get busy with it later I believe roller blading is on todays menu here
by elainekirk 6/28/2011 12:29:59 PM

Startng the covering already mmm that unit must be in a sorry state
by Elaine Kirk 6/28/2011 12:32:26 PM

Once I get back online normally I can try to do a sort by date on photos. That may give some hints on the shifting at the plant
by lillymunster 6/28/2011 12:46:01 PM

New TEPCO president interviewed

The new president of the Tokyo Electric Power Company has told NHK that he will do everything he can to control the crisis at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant.

Toshio Nishizawa assumed the post of TEPCO president on Tuesday.

Nishizawa said the victims of the nuclear disaster will be appropriately compensated, but that to make this happen, government support will be indispensable.

Commenting on 6 other nuclear reactors in Fukushima Prefecture whose fate remains in limbo, Nishizawa said the reactors wouldn't exist without consent of the local people. The 4 crippled reactors at the plant are to be decommissioned.
He also said cost-cutting, sales of the firm's assets and other drastic streamlining measures will proceed before utility charges are raised.

Nishizawa was apparently addressing concerns that fuel costs may rise as a result of increased thermal power generation and massive compensation payments.

Tuesday, June 28, 2011 21:09 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp
by Edano 6/28/2011 12:48:29 PM

rising taxes, rising elecrical power prices - but i guess the japanese keep sleeping. nuke power is so cheap and clean .....
by Edano 6/28/2011 12:51:17 PM

@AustralianCannonball , I had some time to muse about your Sv figures: 0.25 microSv/h makes roughly 2 milliSv/y or 20 microRem/y. This is a very, very low dose. When the German physicist Pflugbeil visited Chernobyl some ten years ago, his G.M. monitor read 150 microSv/h on the parking lot of the plant (documented in a youtube vid. posted here two months ago by Venoui). This translates into 1.3 Sv/y. You may have misinterpreted your Chernobyl reference.
by Peter Melzer 6/28/2011 1:33:01 PM

good morning to every one
by dean 6/28/2011 1:38:56 PM

@dean , ah dean, gm, is the document ready to be handed over to Nancy?
by Peter Melzer 6/28/2011 1:44:14 PM

yes Peter I believe so
by dean 6/28/2011 1:44:34 PM

@Peter sorry it's taken some time,,, I traveled for work and have been pretty busy... this morning and today should lighten up tho... now wondering where to dig in next
by dean 6/28/2011 1:45:28 PM

@dean all right, I shall forward the doc to her and hope that she can put a reference to the NRC letter (like date and ref. number) in. I also remember now what simulation program the Japanese used to analyze seismic reactor safety. It is called MelCor. Have you heard of it?
In another vein, would you know a document that describes the Isolation Condenser and how it differs from the RCIC?
by Peter Melzer 6/28/2011 1:50:03 PM

checking this out @Peter
by dean 6/28/2011 1:50:50 PM

www.hss.doe.gov this is a pretty good start @ Peter
by dean 6/28/2011 1:58:54 PM

I believe that the oldest reactor, the number 1 unit, which is a BWR/3 model with a Mark I containment has a separate isolation condenser. It is an early BWR/3 similar to Dresden Units 2 and 3 in Illinois, which have isolation condensers. The isolation condenser should have prevented the problems observed, so it is a mystery concerning exactly what happened. It has been suggested that Unit 1 experienced a small LOCA due to the earthquake that rendered the isolation condenser unusable. We will find out when the communications improve. The beauty of an isolation condenser is that water in a pool at atmospheric pressure does the cooling (pure water boiling off at 100 degrees C into the atmosphere) and gravity flow circulates the water on the reactor side of the condenser back to the reactor pressure vessel. All that has to be done is periodically put more water into the isolation condenser pool using a fire hose.

It is interesting that the latest BWR designs, which are yet to be built anywhere, including the ESBR, use isolation condensers. “What is old is new again.”

Therefore we see that the old plant, the Number 1 plant was particularly well designed for a loss of all AC power event. Unfortunately, the loss of all AC power event was caused by an extremely large earthquake and a tsumani of immense proportions damaging multiple systems and components. The single most serious issue was the common mode failure due to flooding all of the diesels and wiping out the supply of diesel fuel. As this unfolds, we will learn, why it took so long to get water to the plants. It was the United States Navy that delivered two barges with 60,000 gallons of freshwater a week after the event. There is a dock right there at the plant.
by dean 6/28/2011 2:11:56 PM

ARTICLE
by dean 6/28/2011 2:12:06 PM

@dean , thanks I'll check. My current accident hypothesis is that the RCIC pump sucked the suppression pool dry in units 2 and 3. Unit 1 had an Isolation Condenser. That is why I asked.
by Peter Melzer 6/28/2011 2:12:16 PM

Fukushima Unit No. 1 has isolation condenser. Isolaton condenser helps in mitigating pressure transients and cooling the reactor but it will not help much in maintining reactor water level. Reactor water level will go down at a rate depending upon primary system leak and rate of cooling/depressurisation. Reactor core will uncover in approximately 4 to 8 hours depending upon primary system leak. Thus isolation condenser will give only this much time and within this period, water injection to core has to be established. Due to station black out, coolant injection was not possible and it resulted in core uncovering and damage.
by dean 6/28/2011 2:13:06 PM

true @ Peter, plus would you agree that with the lifting of the primary relief valves the discharge into the suppression chamber raised the temp sufficient to reduce it's affectiveness to supress and maintain a volume of water
by dean 6/28/2011 2:14:53 PM

@dean , That I took away from that Union of Concerned Scientists article you posted last week. The same safety relief valves were actuated over and over again. They are known to have a weakness of sticking open after excessive use. So steam is relieved into the drywell and from there ends up in the suppression pool in the torus. The RCIC pump sucks it up, separates out the steam, and returns less and less into the RPV until no water is left.
by Peter Melzer 6/28/2011 2:21:51 PM

fukushima.grs.de this is a good read @ Peter,,, search on MELCOR
by dean 6/28/2011 2:21:57 PM

in review of that link and others I look for key words like assumed,, ,or for what parameters we could retrieve from the facility etc. some times I think the analysts know what they want the code to tell them and with limited input or initial condition bondary information they some times make assumptions on the non-conservative side and then say the results show that there are no problems. i don't know that to be a fact at fuku but, I wouldn't rule it out either.
by dean 6/28/2011 2:24:24 PM

Away for a few days, come back to: Water recycling at Fukushima nuclear plant stops again mdn.mainichi.jp Some things don't change...
by Markfm 6/28/2011 2:28:12 PM

true markfm
by dean 6/28/2011 2:30:06 PM

Yet another leaking hose. Have to appreciate consistency.
by Markfm 6/28/2011 2:31:20 PM

"The operator of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant says it skipped a scheduled test of the plant's water pipes on Monday, shortly before it was forced to suspend a water recycling operation due to leaks....The utility ran the filtering system, designed to recycle contaminated water for use in cooling the reactors, for just 90 minutes on Monday before treated water was found leaking from unfastened pipes....The operator says it failed to check the 4 kilometers of piping as it had found no problem during an inspection more than 2 weeks ago....The company says it will review that decision."
by Markfm edited by Markfm 6/28/2011 2:32:25 PM

@dean , well certainly I do not understand these simulations well enough to make a judgement call. How do you account for an independent non-linear event in a simulation? Thinking about it, a unobservant construction machine operator reverses the equipment into the water-filled rubberberm and manages to deflate the gismo. The gushing water washes all jerry cans for the little sump pumps away. This is a truly non-linear independent incident which must be difficult to account for, but it just happened. I suppose you must assume the worst case scenario in such calculations.
by Peter Melzer 6/28/2011 2:33:16 PM

@dean, thanks for the material. I'll be reading for a while, :)
by Peter Melzer 6/28/2011 2:35:54 PM

@Peter I'm not a code expert for the guts of it's operation but what I have been successful at in my career from and operations stand point is to look at the assumptions and initial conditions that go into these codes and look at the limitations as one code hands off to another one etc. somewhere hidden in all that there are insights that come out to the real world and also, what are the assumed inputs to keep the codes running based on some assumed parameter or normal interlocked function of he emergency systems. when a little wrench is thrown in the gears like the machine operator,, it's difficult to adjust the defaults in those codes and they just are
like us.. make the best educated guess
by dean 6/28/2011 2:39:13 PM