Japan Earthquake | Page 2790

  • @lillymunster *Important. I have forwarded an email I received from a French community project to your 'gmail' address. They are involved with 'Saving the Children of Japan'. This community is anxious to get involved with our 'scribblelive blog' to help spread the word on the Fukushima disaster and its effects on the health issues it presents. Please keep an eye out for their posting comments, as I will also. Thanks :)
    by MaryW 12/18/2011 4:56:05 PM

  • I remember watching the vid posted here showing a tyvek-clad monk's initiative to go around neighborhoods in Fukushima with his friends offering decontamination. The lady of the house next door ambivalently questioned the presence of the guys in her street because it looked bad for the neighborhood.
    by Peter 12/18/2011 5:01:14 PM

  • .....like seeing a foreclosure sign going up on the lawn next door to your house!
    by Peter 12/18/2011 5:03:06 PM

  • @MaryW will do!
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 5:03:07 PM

  • I come down on the monk's side. But people are irrational and our science education falls way short of the challenges that our technical world poses as lilly pointed out earlier today.
    by Peter 12/18/2011 5:11:06 PM

  • ...in that vein, lilly asked the other day whether the public (military) efforts at decontamination make sense. I believe they do, because they will inevitably demonstrate the limitations of the effort.
    by Peter 12/18/2011 5:13:34 PM

  • @Peter I hope that the decontamination efforts do eventually create a situation where the govt will have to admit some places can't be effectively decontaminated. I think they are slowly doing that by the admission the 50 mSv/year areas are largely a lost cause.
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 5:20:56 PM

  • @MV - that google project may help get across to people elsewhere that the disaster is not over and help is still needed
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 5:24:10 PM

  • About the proposed identity of the silver tubes or rods seen at Unit 3 and fuel tubes www.scribblelive.com someone made the point that fuel tubes turn black after operating at full temps. That's consistent with the fuel tube Arnie showed that he was given and that was black www.youtube.com Peter, does this sound right? Case closed?
    by Ian 12/18/2011 5:50:47 PM

  • Scouring radioactive waste usually means just that. Scrub with soap and water, pails and brushes. Repeat. If it sounds messy, it is—and dangerous too for those exposed to dust and contaminated wastewater.

    Hawaii-based CBI Polymers says it's come up with a better way to clean up nuclear waste. The firm's blue goo may not look high-tech; all you do is pour it. But as the superabsorbent goo gels, its molecules act as a sponge, binding and encapsulating radioactive molecules. Peel the film off and you've got lightweight waste that can be rolled up and disposed of more cheaply and easily than vats of toxic water.

    "It's the same concept as Silly Putty. It gets into every pore, nook, and cranny," says the Department of Energy's Hector Rodriguez, who used it to sop up beryllium, a hazardous metal, left over from weapons research at the National Energy Technology Laboratory in Oregon. The yearlong project cut the labor used in such efforts by 70 percent.

    This year CBI donated 500 gallons to the nuclear cleanup in Japan, where it decontaminated 25,000 square feet of walls, sidewalks, and playgrounds. It's also good on toxic PCBs, asbestos, and heavy metals like mercury—on everything from battleships to power plants—as well as nonindustrial messes. That's heavy-duty work for such humble-looking goo. —Gretchen Parker
    ngm.nationalgeographic.com
    by Cryptococcus 12/18/2011 6:00:27 PM

  • If TEPCO used this blue goo, they would probably just dispose of it in the ocean anyway. :P
    by Cryptococcus 12/18/2011 6:03:30 PM

  • CBI Polymers: decongel.com
    by Cryptococcus 12/18/2011 6:04:14 PM

  • @Cryptococcus interesting stuff. I wonder how well it works on things like clay roof? If people can buy it retail would be a huge help for those trying to lower some levels on their property
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 6:06:28 PM

  • @Ian, according to this wiki en.wikipedia.org uranium oxide pellets are black. In addition plutonium oxide can appear grimy black. I guess that answers the question. upload.wikimedia.org

    by Peter via Upload.wikimedia.org 12/18/2011 6:28:36 PM

  • @Peter, though the tubes in question are zirconium. Was just wondering if you knew that they always blacken after use. Does the blackness of the pellets make the tubes black?
    by Ian 12/18/2011 6:33:52 PM

  • and additionally, the tubes seen in the Unit-3 video are silver, seeming to rule them out as spent-fuel tubes.
    by Ian 12/18/2011 6:35:35 PM

  • @Ian, since you visit the NLM on occasion, about ten years ago I heard a talk by the eminent brain researcher Pasko Rakic who discovered fundamental mechanisms underlying the development of our cerebral cortex. He used x-rays to examine the effect of high doses of ionizing radiation on cortical development. Concluding his talk he said that we had reached a good understanding of the effects of high doses of ionizing radiation on brain development, but lacked an understanding of the impact of low doses. He felt this could be quite different and was an important subject for research in need of funding. How right this man was! Next time you go, check out Rakic's work on the subject.
    by Peter 12/18/2011 6:42:20 PM

  • fukushima impacts uranium stocks trib.com
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 6:44:36 PM

  • @Peter, thanks! In one second I find that he's found evidence that even ultra-sound impairs neuronal migration in fetal brains rakiclab.med.yale.edu What I've previously found on the effects of ionizing radiation on fetal-brain development points to the very same mechanism of impairment... a diminution of neuronal migration.
    by Ian 12/18/2011 6:59:32 PM

  • Is anyone aware that the 20 mSv/y "safety limit" is also a compensation limit, such that only properties contaminated over 20 mSv/y will be compensated?
    by Ian 12/18/2011 7:02:43 PM

  • @Ian , correct, our cortex develops in layers of nerve cells that migrate precisely timed from a primordium into their target layers in an inside-out fashion. High levels of ionizing radiation can muddle up the orderly migration, the layering and the nerve cell connectivity based on the layering.
    by Peter 12/18/2011 7:10:13 PM

  • @Peter, when I reviewed the Chernobyl health-impact literature, I found that research on the effects of Chernobyl fallout was most dramatic wrt fetal-brain development in the gestational period of 8-16 weeks following the the 1986 explosion at Chernobyl. In this narrow range, the set of all available studies clearly weighed in favor of an effect. I've made some headway on a video about this.
    by Ian 12/18/2011 7:14:53 PM

  • @Ian that seems to be the between the lines government statement that 20 mSv is the defacto line of help or expecting people to move home. There are going to be lots of people stuck in govt. limbo.
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 7:20:36 PM

  • @lillymunster, exactly! It follows logically that 20 mSv/y is a compensation limit too, as it's saying no harm was done to your property if the nuclear fallout dumped on it was below that level. And that's indicated in this statement: "National and prefectural governments have determined that until the 20 millisieverts level they are not obligated to offer financial support to residents, certain businesses or schools wanting to relocate outside the irradiated areas." globalspin.blogs.time.com
    by Ian 12/18/2011 7:23:34 PM

  • @Ian It is the out excuse of the govt and a completely incorrect application of ICRP guidelines. 20 mSv is the EMERGENCY acceptable level, not the rest of your lives acceptable level. I so hope the lawyers guild has success in blasting this apart. :-(
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 7:25:45 PM

  • Another new TEPCO definition to add to the list :)

    by MaryW 12/18/2011 7:32:23 PM

  • @Ian , as I pointed out, in brain development timing is everything. The right ingredients - genetic and epigenetic (environmental) factors - have to come to bear together within exact windows of time called critical periods. Otherwise subsequent steps cannot unfold properly and may cause disorders, be it after long delays like autism or schizophrenia.
    by Peter 12/18/2011 7:34:38 PM

  • @lillymunster, and this compensation aspect puts a decidedly ugly spin on the 20 mSv/y limit, that it's probably more to do with money than any honest reading of health science.
    by Ian 12/18/2011 7:36:06 PM

  • LA Times: People just learning that gov’t may be telling fairy tale, says Japan broadcaster — Radiation levels around Fukushima were “almost beyond calculation” — Chernobyl reporters never saw anything like it
    paper.li
    by MaryW 12/18/2011 7:36:16 PM

  • @Ian absolutely. This is about convenience for the government. The easy way to phrase this to people is to remind that this new living standard is the same as German nuclear workers maximum risk. It is just so wrong. I think what it boils down to is that to compensate everyone it would bankrupt the country. So they decide to compensate the worst hit and screw everyone else.
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 7:55:40 PM

  • I knew it! TEPCo to put hole in unit 2 containment to take a look by years end. enenews.com
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 8:02:57 PM

  • trash to gas www.japanfs.org
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 8:24:35 PM

  • Private high school in Minamisoma closes for extended period due to lack of students www.yomiuri.co.jp
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 8:57:00 PM

  • At least 462 trillion becquerels of radioactive strontium have leaked to the Pacific Ocean since the March.

    ajw.asahi.com
    by VesaVA 12/18/2011 9:10:08 PM

  • bump
    by Mid Valley 12/18/2011 10:50:50 PM

  • Japan refugees in New Zealand: Family’s health suffering — Diarrhea, chest problems, swollen glands — “Many of her friends and family back in Fukushima have similar symptoms”. www.odt.co.nz
    by Majj 12/18/2011 10:54:46 PM

  • New life for the theory that the silver tubes are fuel tubes is that fuel pools are used to store new fuel, so there can be silver (ie, not post-use blackened) fuel tube in a SFP. Discussion : www.physicsforums.com
    by Ian 12/18/2011 11:00:23 PM


  • SNL mocks Fukushima — Shows radioactive monkeys replacing Godzilla (VIDEO) enenews.com
    by Majj 12/18/2011 11:02:28 PM

  • @Ian from what Dean mentioned new fuel is left in dry shipping container storage then put into the SFP briefly to irradiate it in some way. I can't remember why they need to do so. MOX fuel has to be stored in the SFP the entire time before use due to high radiation. So if one of the units had unused fuel in a pool would depend on when their next refueling is scheduled. It sounds like in Japan (and possibly elsewhere) they deliver new fuel right before refueling. So #3 was too early in the run to be looking at new fuel. #4 was in an outage for upgrades. # 1 and #2 I can't remember where they were in their fuel cycles. Old TEPCO documents could tell. I do know that #3 had no new fuel in the SFP that they admit. We started on the MOX research because TEPCO had a batch of MOX at Kashiwazaki they can't use and they had clear intentions of increasing how much MOX they put into #3 at each refueling. There is no official record of the fuel being moved but that is about TEPCO's speed to never waste anything even if it risks safety.
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 11:20:36 PM

  • news of the obvious - revenue drops in disaster areas www.yomiuri.co.jp
    by lillymunster 12/18/2011 11:33:03 PM

  • @lillymunster, wow! Good sweep of facts! My head's a bit dizzy trying to help this silver-object inquiry, so much input.
    by Ian 12/18/2011 11:57:47 PM

  • @lillymunster, someone posted this page that says SFP3 had 52 Unirradiated Fuel Assemblies www.iaea.org This seems to support the possibility that the silver objects might be fuel tubes.
    by Ian 12/19/2011 12:41:31 AM

  • @Ian interesting. It lists all used and new fuel in each pool. We need to make sure Smoss sees this
    by lillymunster 12/19/2011 12:50:46 AM

  • why does unit 4 have 204 unirradiated assemblies in it?
    by lillymunster 12/19/2011 12:52:19 AM

  • WTH? School in Saitama making children gargle with tea to prevent influzenza. Saitama is the region with tea full of cesium that is still full of cesium. ex-skf.blogspot.com
    by lillymunster 12/19/2011 12:59:13 AM

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