Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 1237

Containment failed as the containment temperature exceeds
260°C (500°F) and all electric penetration modules are blown
out of the containment. Mass and energy addition rates into
the drywell are:
by dean 5/17/2011 8:37:12 PM

@dean ty for your figures & analysis. - although I'm not sure if ty' is appropriate for such grim news
by UKVal 5/17/2011 8:38:31 PM

Hi all, just got back in. What the heck is going on??? :-)
by Nancy 5/17/2011 8:39:04 PM

temp of the corium assumed to be initially 1433C - 2600F
by dean 5/17/2011 8:39:25 PM

TEMP OF CORIUM acting on concrete floor 1771C - 3100F
by dean 5/17/2011 8:41:07 PM

really leaves me speechless. what can be done now ?
by Edano 5/17/2011 8:41:40 PM

@elaine @cat There really is. 2 has been churning as well. I was in a trance watching the cam and I noticed an increase in brightness within 4 and shortly thereafter it's been smoking oUt the top and side.
by LM 5/17/2011 8:41:46 PM

NOW.. this all has to be tempered with assumptions on the case 1, 2, 3 against the fukushima plants,,, in question is.. reported earlier that one of the emergency diesels were not available due to the earth quake and the running EG stopped before 1 hour
by dean 5/17/2011 8:42:16 PM

yes I saw it and the camera operator did try for better contrast @lm
by elainekirk 5/17/2011 8:42:54 PM

@dean, so I understand your spreadsheet & analysis, are you saying these things *have* actually happened based on actual data/readings and your expertise, or are you saying they *would* happen in the sequence described if any of the three scenarios are true?
by jay 5/17/2011 8:44:23 PM

I saw a mention I needed to grab Dean's information and post it for referencing? Is it back a few pages? Not seeing it.
by Nancy 5/17/2011 8:44:25 PM

also in question.. is the operability of the high pressure injection system, the turbine feed water system (some confusion on steam supply coming from upstream of the isolation valve to the turbine)
by dean 5/17/2011 8:44:30 PM

nancy.. it's pinned.. but the excel file didn't show right
by dean 5/17/2011 8:44:54 PM

@Elaine.. The camera people have really been trying to show us an accurate picture. I'm grateful.
by LM 5/17/2011 8:45:09 PM

@nancy the pin at the top we need it as a pic link we camn add to deamns pin
by elainekirk 5/17/2011 8:45:09 PM

I will email the excel to you nancy.. I wanted to show it here as I was trying to finish the write up
@dean good idea I find my docs ewarping I think because I zoomed out to get it all in the frame
by dean edited by elainekirk 5/17/2011 8:45:12 PM

@dean Ok, so wait for the final one, make it web viewable and put it online so people get get at it?
Oh good I will take the warped one down then :) ty
by Nancy edited by elainekirk 5/17/2011 8:46:02 PM

@jay : this is an extrapolation on the facts that were revealed yesterdfay by tepco.
by Edano 5/17/2011 8:46:11 PM

once the corium is out of the vessel it acts on the concrete containment floor and the temps go up to the point of electrical penetration assemblies seal failures which allows small leakage and then finally complete failure of the assembly to allow more corium to move
by dean 5/17/2011 8:47:33 PM

@dean : ty again i had no idea how fast this happens.
by Edano 5/17/2011 8:48:05 PM

that was shown in some of the photo's from chernobyl where the corium leaked out every path, some were slow small holes and others were larger so it spreads out the corium
by dean 5/17/2011 8:48:40 PM

@dean 'once the corium is out of the vessel it acts on the concrete containment floor and the temps go up' why do they go up not down?
by UKVal 5/17/2011 8:49:17 PM

early in the accident don't we remember where the operators were going to vent and some of those hand to be manually
by dean 5/17/2011 8:50:10 PM

Looking right onto the primary containment though the open tool pit to see that the reactor was blowing out steam big time on March 27th : www.youtube.com
by Ian 5/17/2011 8:50:47 PM

BTW, someone mentioned bedrock? The "bedrock" under Fukushima is a layer of shale over a huge water table. I can go back and find the geologic descriptions and distances if they are needed. That is something I don't know well enough but seems like a rather scary concept, if it could melt through that shale layer and hit that huge water table while still really hot.
by Nancy 5/17/2011 8:51:23 PM

also it is assumed that the scram happens in 4 seconds and the motor driven control rods drive in for 5 minutes
by dean 5/17/2011 8:51:37 PM

@Dean Might that explain the smaller amount of steam we've seen from 3 in the last few days...
by LM 5/17/2011 8:52:12 PM

Nancy.. it would really be nice to find prints of how those electrical penetration assemblies are , where they are etc.. that may be a saving grace to spread out the corium and break it up
by dean 5/17/2011 8:52:35 PM

"During the interaction between corium and concrete, very high temperatures can be achieved. Less volatile aerosols of Ba, Ce, La, Sr, and other fission products are formed during this phase and introduced into the containment building at time when most of early aerosols is already deposited. Tellurium is released with progress of zirconium telluride decomposition. Bubbles of gas flowing through the melt promote aerosol formation" en.wikipedia.org(nuclear_reactor)
by Edano 5/17/2011 8:52:42 PM

@Nancy do we know for certain it's shale. I've been trying to find out
by UKVal 5/17/2011 8:52:54 PM

@dean : yes i have read this article several times. very good information.
by Edano 5/17/2011 8:54:39 PM

@LM I've just seen the brightness on the cam. It's square shape
by UKVal 5/17/2011 8:55:12 PM

@LM it could be another hole in the wall, but if so it's brighter than the others & in a new place. looks more like something inside
by UKVal 5/17/2011 8:57:03 PM