Japan Earthquake | Page 1248

  • Curious that Tepco was quoted on March 16 as having said : "The possibility of re-criticality is not zero". www.bbc.co.uk
    by Ian 5/18/2011 1:59:28 PM

  • Japan's Dumping of Radioactive Water Based on U.S. Request: Cabinet Adviser jen.jiji.com
    by Bobby1 5/18/2011 2:06:02 PM

  • @Elaine, do you have the link to the TEPCO page that has all the documents in it from the big data dump? I have everything but and someone is asking on the other page.
    by Nancy 5/18/2011 2:06:40 PM

  • Tepco Misleading Public Over Nuclear Crisis www.bloomberg.com
    by Bobby1 5/18/2011 2:19:07 PM

  • Wow, the blog of the Nuclear Engineering Dept at U.C. Berkeley reads like a Greenpeace blog! : www.nuc.berkeley.edu
    by Ian 5/18/2011 2:31:43 PM

  • Nancy, I carry the TEPCO link in my pinned list, TEPCO 16 May release of plant data collected: www.tepco.co.jp That link then has the links to the data pages.
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 2:37:00 PM

  • Changes, 17 May vs. 18 May 6:00 plant parameters. #1 water injection dropped from 10 down to 6 cubic m/hr, RPV pressures up 25 and 40 kPa, about 3C rises in RPV and DW temps, CAMS reporting started again for DW, with DW B channel showing 25 Sv/hr (highest of the 3 reactors DW readings). #2 values shown as stable or slightly decreasing, they've started reporting the 2nd RPV temp again (124C). #3 they'e bumped water injection via the water supply line, total of 18 cubic/m/hr vs. 15 yesterday, RPV temps shown decreasing 29 and 6C, DW RPV bellows temp shown increased +12C to 146C, while HVH return shown decreasing 43C to 125C (why this inversion in what's hot?), CAMS radiation readings continue slow decrease.
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:04:02 PM

  • NHK articles carried in today's JAIF Earthquake Report: (Fukushima NPP site)●Workers enter No.2 reactor building ●TEPCO to focus on water circulation ●TEPCO may face more problems in stabilizing plant ●TEPCO releases Fukushima plant videos (Other News) ●Fishermen claim damages from TEPCO ●IAEA to investigate Fukushima nuclear accident ●Japan apologizes for radiation concerns ●Farmers to make 1st damages claim against TEPCO
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:07:47 PM

  • Looked through the Plant 1 DW readings from yesterday and today. Yesterday the b-reading showed 218 sv/h and today 45 sv/h. (yesterday: www.tepco.co.jp and today: www.tepco.co.jp)
    by Mina 5/18/2011 3:19:54 PM

  • I wonder if those instruments are toasty -- at least NISA wasn't showing data there until their latest report (18 May 6:00) -- nothing reported for 17 May 6:00. For it to have been 218 Sv/hr as of 13:00 on 17 May, dropped to 25 Sv/hr on 18 May at 6:00 (the NISA value), then rise again to 45 Sv/hr on 18 May at 12:00 would be "interesting".
    by Markfm edited by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:26:46 PM

  • @nancy sorry been out did you get the link @mark posted?
    by elainekirk 5/18/2011 3:27:01 PM

  • @Nancy or Anyone else, do you have a link for those colorful plant status spreadsheet/chart things that list data for each plant?
    by RBeaner 5/18/2011 3:27:10 PM

  • The NISA Japanese reports, couple pages of graphics, followed by the table? Here's the English version of the 17 March 6:00 graphics portion: www.nisa.meti.go.jp
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:30:05 PM

  • @RBeaner The Georgian govt. has an English version a few days after the Japanese version is released. Let me know if you need the link
    by Nancy 5/18/2011 3:32:08 PM

  • @Mina isn't that 2.18 Sv/hr yesterday and 4.54 Sv/hr today?? I looked and saw decimals. ??
    by Meretisa 5/18/2011 3:33:02 PM

  • @elainekirk yes I grabbed the link. Going through that TEPCo document I started translating last night. It has some info in it and good detail on things like the heat exchangers and the water treatment but they absolutely avoid talking about big things like the structural damage at 4.
    by Nancy 5/18/2011 3:33:22 PM

  • @Meretisa The E+02 means times times 100. Scientific notation. (times 10 to the second power)
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:36:28 PM

  • @Meretisa: after the decimals there is this +02 (for yesterday) and +01 (today), so that you have to change the decimal place, it is the same like an exponent.
    by Mina 5/18/2011 3:37:07 PM

  • @Markfm oh dear. :( erm... I thought that 10 Sv means death? This is truly 218 Sv/hr and 454 Sv/hr?? OMG.
    by Meretisa 5/18/2011 3:37:46 PM

  • Thank you Markfm, I was too slow :-)!
    by Mina 5/18/2011 3:37:48 PM

  • @you oh. so it was the 218 and 45. wow. still horribly high! where is this B located??
    by Meretisa 5/18/2011 3:38:20 PM

  • Just a couple of notes about TEPCO deception...

    1. TEPCO stated back on Mar 17 www.tepco.co.jp -Today, at approximately 10am, we observed 400mSv/h at the inland side
    of the Unit 3 reactor building and 100mSv/h at the inland side of the
    Unit 4 reactor building. That 100 page leak document implied these levels were not disclosed.

    2. On 16 mar, this article www.bbc.co.uk stated "the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC), which has a team of 11 experts advising in Japan, says the pool {speaking of SFP#4} is completely dry." Which was of course incorrect

    3. The company, known as Tepco, yesterday reiterated the schedule on its so-called road map announced a month ago to achieve cold shutdown of the three radiation-leaking reactors as early as October www.bloomberg.com , well that is their goal, 5 months provides wiggle room on unforseen events. Will they make it, who knows, but at least they established a timetable for goals, cold plants are probably achievable.

    4. I have yet to see any scientific evidence of inadvertant criticality (fissioning) at any plant or pool.

    5. On 3/16, TEPCO announced significant fuel damage (melting) at reactors 1 and 2 english.kyodonews.jp
    by RBeaner 5/18/2011 3:39:23 PM

  • good morning, afternoon, evening or nite to all
    by dean 5/18/2011 3:39:51 PM

  • @Meretisa -- That's why I'm curious about if those are valid readings. Possible, I just do not know, other than that it looks like #1 drywell CAMS was offline for some time (not reported). Calibration could be bad or those could be real -- flip a coin.
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:42:28 PM

  • @Ian That's not a blog, it's a forum, all OPINIONS are accepted and generally respected. Not the opionion of engineering students in most posts.
    by RBeaner 5/18/2011 3:42:34 PM

  • math point... some times you see 10 with a small 5 .. or 10 to the 5th power... other math numbers are represented as e to the Xth power... "e" is a numerical constant that is equal to 2.71828
    by dean 5/18/2011 3:46:59 PM

  • so if you see e+02 would mean e*e.. and so on
    by dean 5/18/2011 3:47:32 PM

  • @dean (head explodes from math overload)
    by Meretisa 5/18/2011 3:48:05 PM

  • www.ndt-ed.org explanation for "e"
    by dean 5/18/2011 3:48:07 PM

  • lol meretisa,,, I noticed earlier on the comment about e+02 ..
    by dean 5/18/2011 3:48:34 PM

  • @dean Don't think so IIRC 5E+2 would be 500, thats a big E not a little one, poers of 10
    by RBeaner 5/18/2011 3:49:00 PM

  • I doubt (hope?) that even TEPCO would start reporting things using base e (I'd grant them a typo).
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:49:11 PM

  • @dean yeah. I'm an English/Grammar person... math puts numbers with letters breaks my brain. LOL
    by Meretisa 5/18/2011 3:49:20 PM

  • (B):2.18E+02Sv/h = 218 Sv/hr
    by RBeaner 5/18/2011 3:50:18 PM

  • Fortunately my comment said E+02 :)
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:51:07 PM

  • Thanks for pointing out the TEPCO English plant parameters releases -- I'd gotten so used to looking at the NISA Japanese report that I had forgot to look at TEPCO's site.
    by Markfm 5/18/2011 3:54:38 PM

  • @RBeaner, well it's layout looked blog-like. :)
    by Ian 5/18/2011 4:39:34 PM

  • if anyone interested, "NUCLEAR MELTDOWN" Airs May 18 and 22nd on CNBC www.cnbc.com
    by Panserbjorne9 5/18/2011 4:41:58 PM

  • @RBeaner, does the paper by Tetsuo Matsui suggest criticality? arxiv.org I don't think it does wrt Unit 3, but then the data on the U3 fuel pool wasn't out when his paper was posted. A report on his paper www.technologyreview.com reads: "Today, Tetsuo Matsui at the University of Tokyo, says the limited data from Fukushima indicates that nuclear chain reactions must have reignited at Fuksuhima up to 12 days after the accident."
    by Ian 5/18/2011 4:42:09 PM

  • I am almost done translating that document. I noticed their water recirculation plan is dependent on a couple of things. One is getting into the building to get at the supression chamber/torus hatch to put a pipe in to suck water back out. They will have to actually be able to get down there in the lower level. Then plan to continue watering so there will be water in the lower levels. This also does nothing to solve the water running off as even though they will pump it back out it still allow water to leak out cracks.
    by Nancy 5/18/2011 4:43:12 PM

  • @RBeaner, there's talk that isotopic-ration data is available that Chris Busby says is proof of nuclear explosions. Yesterday Bobby1 here was explaining what that's so and among other things he cited this report onioni2.blogspot.com that notes that : "Hiroaki Koide from Kyoto University has mentioned about this mysterious Iodine 135. He said that the huge amount of Iodine 135 supports the speculation of nuclear explosion at the #3 reactor on March 14." I'd like to here some knowledgeable skeptical responses.
    by Ian 5/18/2011 4:48:21 PM

  • isotopic-ratio
    by Ian 5/18/2011 4:49:05 PM

  • @Ian The best argument is from the Tc-99m, Te-132, I-132, I-131 ratios.
    A. Tc-99m 130,378
    B. Te-132 25,177
    C. I-132 35,700
    D. I-131 55,607
    E. Ba-140 542
    F. La-140 1,521
    A > B+C > D > E+F = nuke
    Koide, Busby and Gundersen have all espoused criticality theories. I really think Gundersen has been vindicated.
    by Bobby1 5/18/2011 4:55:23 PM

  • @Bobby1, but it's an argument I and 99% of the population can't follow! :)
    by Ian 5/18/2011 4:58:39 PM

  • I cannot comment as I do not like Busby , I feel the fear and panic he is causing in his quest for fame and fortune is terrible . I also look on Tepco with the same disgust , how can they mislead their fellow countrymen into thinking there are no real risks when they know they have caused a future illness not yet manifested in many many of them.
    by elainekirk 5/18/2011 5:02:43 PM

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