Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 1133

@lillymunster If I understand NISA reports properly, water injection to the reactors is a continuous process. Water recirculates in the cooling systems. They have suspended it at times to make some adjustments and repairs to the systems. Injection to SFPs is periodic.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:24:03 PM

Yes, you're right.
by Markfm 5/12/2011 5:24:10 PM

@Nancy I think the first hydrazine injection was to #3 on 5/9 12:39-2:36pm.
by LM 5/12/2011 5:25:23 PM

@Lethbridgean That information[referring to atomicpowerreview.blogspot.com post] has been at TEPCO's website for at least a couple of weeks. Old news.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:26:35 PM

@Nancy The dates on their releases are messed up. For all I know the days are screwed up. They are listing overlapping data for the same dates on different press releases.
by LM 5/12/2011 5:27:11 PM

@Pedro Jesus - I don't really care if it is old news. Funny how it is dated today though.
by Lethbridgean 5/12/2011 5:28:10 PM

@LM Yes, I confirm that. TEPCO's press releases are inconsistent and should be double checked. NISA is a good source. They keep their reports cleaner. Not easy to read though. Overload of information.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:28:53 PM

@Lethbridgean Well, I remember reporting that last week with the link to a IAEA page where they refer all that that can be read in the article you posted. I guess atomicpowerreview take sometime to publish the information they get from the same sources I use.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:30:42 PM

If that is right that they started hydrazine after the morning of the 8th then it would not be the cause of the steam incidents
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:30:51 PM

So am I now banished as well?
by RBeaner 5/12/2011 5:31:02 PM

@RBeaner if you have a specific aspect you want covered please run with it. Your one of the more industry experience on the board. Let people know what you need for input and what your wanting to put together. BTW, I don't think your banished. Thought you went offline or something?
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:32:31 PM

i wonder why they have pressure readings of 150 & 50 atm in #1 core, while the core is breached and water is at 93°. maybe we should forget all the readings ?
by Edano 5/12/2011 5:35:01 PM

@lillymunster What Lethbridgean has just posted can be part of the explanation for that smoke/steam. We know from TEPCO that they suspect structural damage to some CVs. We also know from TEPCO and IAEA that there are suspected leaks from pumps at some RPVs. We also know that they vent the CVs periodically. Putting all this together it is only natural that there will be periodic release of steam for a long time to come.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:35:12 PM

Is this the first time we are reading the leaked water amounts?

The low level of water indicates that the core of Unit 1 had a bigger breach than expected, said TEPCO spokesman Junichi Matsumoto.

Cooling water has been leaking from the reactor cores of Units 2 and 3 as well, allowing an estimated 70,000 tons of contaminated water to pool inside the complex, which TEPCO has been struggling to bring under control for two months.

Read more: www.kansascity.com
by Veen Oui 5/12/2011 5:35:29 PM

@Veen Oui No, we have seen that number for a few weeks now. I'm surprised it hasn't changed. It must be old news.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:36:45 PM

scrib has an autospam function that throws people into mod if it thinks they are spamming I have noticed if they post twice without anyone commenting between posts it can do it and there will be other situations no doubt. I don't know the details but I do know it throws people into mod regularly and mods rescue them asap
by elainekirk 5/12/2011 5:37:45 PM

@Veen Oui I mean, they have been moving that leaked water around and trying to decontaminate part of it for sometime now and I would expect the whole figure to have gone higher because the leaks haven't yet been addressed due to the high radiation levels inside the units.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:38:41 PM

@Pedro Jesus right but wouldn't a pressure build up be seen on some equipment?
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:38:59 PM

@Pedro Jesus Ok, I was just wondering, sine their storage facilities are not even 10%.........
by Veen Oui 5/12/2011 5:39:00 PM

@lillymunster How can Pressure be messured if the temps supposedly are not moving upwards either?.........something stinks here
by Veen Oui 5/12/2011 5:40:10 PM

@lillymunster I'd hope so. It would mean the gauges are working properly. It's worth investigating. There should be periodic increase and decrease in pressure. Thing is, they might be measuring only before or after they release pressure. We don't know that tiny piece of information, do we. We'll have to piece it together.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:41:07 PM

@elainekirk I tried to post, and it said I was Spam, which is person non grat to me. When I checked back, all my posts were gone, infact references inside posts to my name were gone. They now appear to be back. I will not use the word R a d i a t i o n again
by RBeaner 5/12/2011 5:41:40 PM

cryptothose picme.org
by Lurking edited by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:41:49 PM

@Pedro Jesus I looked at #3 on the 8th. 2am same numbers it had run for days. 5am (release was about 3am along with theEQs) about the same numbers. Seems odd it would spike and go back down within that small 3hr window.
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:42:54 PM

@RBeaner : try to not spam then.
by Edano 5/12/2011 5:43:02 PM

Enlarged photos from previous release
by Lurking 5/12/2011 5:43:04 PM

@Lurking : great, thx !
by Edano 5/12/2011 5:45:36 PM

@Lurking What happened to #3? It looks much worse than before. Can steam do that?
by Bobby1 5/12/2011 5:46:21 PM

@Bobby1 those images are from late april
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:49:10 PM

@Bobby1, it does look much worse. It seems to be less and less every time I see it. I have wondered if they started doing demo or if it is the result of a fire or another explosion. I will leave the determination up to people with more knowledge than I have.
by Lurking 5/12/2011 5:49:27 PM

@lillymunster The changes in temp and pressure would be slight though. I do not expect any real spikes. It is a very slow process, maybe slow enough for the data to show no fluctuation. You see, temperature and pressure are interdependent, when one goes up, the other goes up, and the other way around. It is not difficult to keep them under control if you have the means (which they should have) including both automated systems and human monitoring 24/7 (which I guess they do). That's why I don't see how the total meltdown scenario with melted fuel burning a whole into the concrete floor and leaking away matches the data we have.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:50:21 PM

@lillymunster @Lurking Do we have a timeline on damage to the #3 building? Are there intermittent fires or something?
by Bobby1 5/12/2011 5:50:36 PM

We have this: spreadsheets.google.com
by Pedro Jesus edited by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:51:39 PM

@Bobby1 there were no reported fires etc after the explosion. 3 looks the same now as it did the days after the explosion. I have seen no changes in the condition of #3, 4 is another story
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:53:24 PM

@lillymunster I thought I saw fires on the tippycam. Just trying to get an idea of the temperatures involved. This affects the type of radionuclides that are released.
by Bobby1 5/12/2011 5:56:03 PM

@Pedro Jesus I just updated that to the latest the NYT ha. They seem to bother to update it about once a week.
by radioguy 5/12/2011 5:56:28 PM

@lillymunster There are two anonymous changing information on the spreadsheet I've just linked. Is that supposed to happen?
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:56:42 PM

(I meant anonymous users)
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:57:28 PM

@radioguy Ah, good one. =)
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 5:58:19 PM

Info on hydrazine...carcinogen..................Based principally on the weight-of-evidence-based assessments of international or other national agencies, a critical effect for characterization of risk to human health for hydrazine is carcinogenicity. Increased incidences of bronchial tumours in male and female rats, thyroid tumours in male rats, and nasal tumours in hamsters were observed after inhalation exposure. Increased incidences of lung tumours were observed in mice of both sexes after oral exposure. Genotoxicity was observed in both in vivo and in vitro assays with hydrazine. Based on tumours observed in multiple sites in experimental rodents for which modes of induction have not been fully elucidated, it cannot be precluded that hydrazine induces tumours via a mode of action involving direct interaction with genetic materials. www.ec.gc.ca
by LM 5/12/2011 5:58:23 PM

@LM does it do all those lovely things when vaporized?
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:58:53 PM

@Pedro Jesus whose spreadsheet is it
by lillymunster 5/12/2011 5:59:15 PM

@Pedro Jesus They can change the sort, but it's on my googledocs site, and the only write access I gave to marie so tech stuff could be entered into the framework. That never happened.
by radioguy 5/12/2011 6:00:03 PM

@lillymunster Honestly, I can't remember, but it was set up by one of us and some of us have access to it. I didn't know we would let anonymous users change it though. Maybe it just doesn't show whoever is changing the data for security reasons.
by Pedro Jesus 5/12/2011 6:00:30 PM