Japan Earthquake

Japan Earthquake | Page 1228

The "oil"
fire?
by Ralph Unger 5/17/2011 8:49:15 AM

No the nocturnal big smokes, there were 2 over the past week
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 8:49:47 AM

@Ralph - the water level readings didn't vary, in other words the guages were stuck/bust
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 8:50:20 AM

@Ralph - this www.tepco.co.jp is #1 water levels - "constant" (until they discovered there wasn't any!
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 8:52:44 AM

@hudebnik That's not exactly correct. There is some water in the RPV, but the gauges were not giving the exact readings, they were indicating more water than there is actually in the RPV. The graph shows variations, otherwise the water level would be a straight horizontal line.
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 8:55:17 AM

@Pedro - true but the variations are almost all tiny steps of 50mm which I suspect is the granularity of the gauge, +/- 25mm
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:02:50 AM

@hudebnik How would you explain the first one tenth of the graph line then?
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:09:04 AM

NEWS ADVISORY: TEPCO to step up efforts to prevent tainted groundwater from spreading (17:56) [Kyodo]
a new issue ?
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:10:54 AM

@Pedro - I think the beginning of the graph line shows the water level before the melted fuel went through the RPV, which if the graph is right happened on 12/13 March, which tallies with what is now admitted.
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:14:13 AM

Nuclear plant cooling system manually shut down

The operator of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant says workers may have manually shut down the No.1 reactor's emergency cooling system in order to prevent damage to the reactor. It says pressure inside the reactor had dropped sharply after the earthquake struck the plant on March 11th.

Tokyo Electric Power Company on Monday disclosed records of its operations at the plant.

They show that the reactor automatically halted operations after the earthquake.

The emergency cooling system was automatically activated but stopped about 10 minutes later and remained off for about 3 hours until after the tsunami arrived.

TEPCO says plant workers may have manually shut down the cooling system because pressure inside the reactor had dropped sharply from 70 to 45 atmospheres.

The system is designed to cool the reactor even if all external sources of power are lost, but the move to shut it down temporarily means that it did not fully function.

TEPCO says the decision may have been made based on a manual to prevent damage to the reactor.

It says if the system had worked, it may have had more time until the meltdown, so it will investigate developments leading up to the decision to turn it off and whether the move was correct.

Tuesday, May 17, 2011 13:18 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp

so there was damage by the earthquake. it is really the week of revelations.
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:16:27 AM

@hudebnik So you're still saying that there is NO water left inside the RPV contrary to TEPCO's claim? What makes you think that?
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:18:30 AM

@Edano Do you have the link to the groundwater news?
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:19:32 AM

@Edano - my reading of those events is that the earthquake probably caused a break in the #1 primary water cooling circuit (like a fractured pipe).
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:19:53 AM

Generator trucks proved useless at Fukushima plant

The operator of the stricken Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant says dozens of power-generating trucks brought to the plant just after the March 11th disaster mostly proved to be useless.

About 70 generator trucks from the Self-Defense Forces and other entities headed to the plant after the quake knocked out external power and the tsunami disabled the facility's backup generators.

But plant operator TEPCO says debris strewn across the compound and flooded switchboards hampered the trucks' set up.

The utility says a switchboard for the No.2 reactor was finally wired to one of the generator trucks about 24 hours after the disaster.
But moments later, a hydrogen explosion at the neighboring No.1 reactor fried the wiring and cut off the power supply from the truck.

Another hydrogen explosion 2 days later at the No.3 reactor damaged generator vehicles with chunks of flying concrete.

Electricity was finally restored to the plant through the regular power grid on March 21st --- 10 days after the quake and tsunami.

Tuesday, May 17, 2011 09:59 +0900 (JST)
www3.nhk.or.jp
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:20:50 AM

@Pedro - well it depends on where the corium is really, is some still in the reactor plugging the water leak or is it in the containment beneath a puddle of water?
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:21:17 AM

The water level readings seem to be the least reliable of all - I wonder if the other reactors are the same...?
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:22:43 AM

@Edano At least this "NEWS ADVISORY: TEPCO to step up efforts to prevent tainted groundwater from spreading" implicates that they admit there is tainted groundwater (not just tainted water in some pits, given groundwater is translated correct)
by andrea 5/17/2011 9:24:02 AM

interesting details - a protocol of failure.
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:24:29 AM

@hudebnik We'll have to wait for the next episode.
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:25:30 AM

@andrea That news about the tainted ground water is probably related to the spill that happened last week while they were transferring contaminated water. Some of the radioactive water spilled to the ground. I don't see anything new apart from that and I also can't find any news link at Kyodo website about it, that's why I asked Edano to provide a link.
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:28:41 AM

The US Nuclear Regulatory Commission says it has halted 24-hour monitoring of Japan's Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant as conditions are slowly stabilizing there.　　[NHK]　　　joke of the day
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:31:43 AM

Japan's top government spokesman [Edano ?] has demanded TEPCO to present a detailed report on how workers manually shutdown the reactor's emergency cooling system before the tsunami struck.　　[NHK]
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:35:59 AM

@Pedro Jesus : it is a "breaking news" on kyodo news without details.
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:40:58 AM

@Edano Thanks. But I would guess it is related to that recent spill. Lets wait and see.
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:41:40 AM

Nuclear plant cooling system manually shut down "The operator of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant says workers may have manually shut down the No.1 reactor's emergency cooling system in order to prevent damage to the reactor. It says pressure inside the reactor had dropped sharply after the earthquake struck the plant on March 11th." www3.nhk.or.jp
by Ralph Unger 5/17/2011 9:42:54 AM

The evidence that has come out so far suggests that the groundwater beneath the plant is probably being extensively polluted by rad leaking through cracks in the various basements.
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:43:35 AM

the corium at the bottom may have built up to more than 1 meter. i am not sure if they can distinguish water level from corium level. maybe there is no water in rpv and the gauges read the corium height. [theory]
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:45:44 AM

@hudebnik What evidence is that?
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:46:55 AM

If it is not going into the sea (as readings suggest) it must be going into the ground.
by Ralph Unger 5/17/2011 9:47:38 AM

now we have 2 full months since meltdown. maybe we should take corium in groundwater in account.
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:47:51 AM

@hudebnik I believe you are right there !!

by elainekirk 5/17/2011 9:48:04 AM

There is not enough energy in the fuel to evaporate all the water they are adding.
by Ralph Unger 5/17/2011 9:48:53 AM

@Pedro - well we know that basements in reactors 1-3 have lots of radioactive water in them, that there has been/is leakage into the sea. that the rad level in groundwater is high (all discussed on this board in the past couple of days)
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:49:34 AM

I believe it was @wtm that had read the same thing I had read and it said 28days to go through the cement and hit bedrock in research that was done...............
by Angie 5/17/2011 9:50:13 AM

I think the whole place is leaking like a sieve basically or grim joke like a Sv.
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:50:20 AM

REPEAT POST, since nobody read it ......
by Veenie 5/17/2011 9:51:21 AM

Nuke Plant: Ground May Have Shifted So Much That It May Have Caused Damage to Foundation: Arnie Gun... bit.ly
by Veenie 5/17/2011 9:51:36 AM

Good night
by Veenie 5/17/2011 9:51:48 AM

@Veenie : you should get used to provide links by now.
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:52:16 AM

@Veenie Night sleep well my little friend!
by Angie 5/17/2011 9:52:45 AM

@Angie - well we don't have proof the corium has done that but as Arnie Gun said if the ground level has dropped 30-50 cm (1 - 1.5ft for the oldies) concrete is likely to have cracked.
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:52:52 AM

www.fairewinds.com
by hudebnik 5/17/2011 9:53:41 AM

@hudebnik : no, not necessarily. as i understand it, the entire plate has moved.
by Edano 5/17/2011 9:54:12 AM

@hudebnik Oh I am not saying there is proof of it just saying what some research had said..........I agree with you I think its one big cracked mess down there..........you cant have that many quakes without some damage.
by Angie 5/17/2011 9:54:19 AM

@hudebnik But there is radiation missing from the various readings. There should be an ever increasing trend on the radiation readings as more and more contaminated water leaks and accumulates (increasing the concentration of radioactive particulates) and we can't find evidence of that happening. Water infiltrates very easily but radioactive particulates don't. I think we should get more facts before making such an assumption on the little data we have. Also, if the molten fuel should have by now infiltrated the ground and all the water have had leaked, there wouldn't be any water in the basement, for one, and radiation inside the building would slowly start decreasing. We have two pieces of evidence that contradict that assumption [that the molten fuel has already leaked into the ground and that there is no water in the RPV].
by Pedro Jesus 5/17/2011 9:57:23 AM